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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 15 to 39 of 61. Go back in thread:
Posted by zazenducke on February 14, 2008, at 18:52:21
In reply to Re: please be civil » Dr. Bob, posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on February 14, 2008, at 1:54:17
As a philosophy, multiculturalism began as part of the pragmatism movement at the end of the nineteenth century in Britain and in the United States, then as political and cultural pluralism at the turn of the twentieth. It was partly in response to a new wave of European imperialism in sub-Saharan Africa and the massive immigration of Southern and Eastern Europeans to the United States and Latin America. Philosophers, psychologists and historians and early sociologists such as Charles Sanders Peirce, William James, George Santayana, Horace Kallen, John Dewey, W.E.B. Du Bois and Alain Locke developed concepts of cultural pluralism, from which emerged what we understand today as multiculturalism. In Pluralistic Universe (1909), William James espoused the idea of a "plural society." James saw pluralism as "crucial to the formation of philosophical and social humanism to help build a better, more egalitarian society.[1]
In the Western English-speaking countries, multiculturalism as an official national policy started in Canada in 1971
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiculturalism
Jay I don't believe it is quite accurate to say Canada invented multiculturalism, at least according to the Wiki article above. But Canada is certainly to be commended for embracing the philosophy originated by the British and Americans and making it national policy :)Ideas are our best exports.
> Plus, I am Canadian. We invennted, and embrace multi-culturalism. :-)
>
> Thanks,
> Jay
>
Posted by Toph on February 14, 2008, at 19:16:19
In reply to Please Be Civil » Toph, posted by Deputy 10derHeart on February 14, 2008, at 18:33:47
> >a disturbing pattern of offensive posts
>
> Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down.
>Just curious, if the posts weren't offensive, then why was the poster blocked for a year?
Posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on February 14, 2008, at 19:45:21
In reply to Re: peace and love, posted by Dr. Bob on February 14, 2008, at 1:56:10
Posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on February 14, 2008, at 20:04:06
In reply to the invention of multi-culturalism » Jay_Bravest_Face, posted by zazenducke on February 14, 2008, at 18:52:21
I think this topic probably belongs on another board, but I thought it was obvious I was far from being literal.
Jay
Posted by Justherself54 on February 14, 2008, at 20:04:42
In reply to Re: blocked for 1 week » Phoenix1, posted by Deputy 10derHeart on February 14, 2008, at 18:34:15
Why does simply speaking the truth deserve a block?
I FEEL Phoenix1 has turned out to be one of the most supportive and informed posters and has helped me greatly.
I FEEL so sick of the civility rules and all the I, I, I,'s we have to rack our brains about before we post.
I FEEL what he said was nothing but the truth..
I FEEL this will not only hurt Phoenix1 but also all the people he is and could be helping during his block..
I FEEL very, very angry!!
Posted by Dinah on February 14, 2008, at 21:02:55
In reply to Re: Please Be Civil » Deputy 10derHeart, posted by Toph on February 14, 2008, at 19:16:19
Dr. Bob has long held the position that blocked posters are protected equally under the civility guidelines and the same rules apply to everyone. So even if someone is blocked for saying something, maybe even especially if someone is blocked for saying something, Babblers still have to be careful not to post anything that could lead them to feel accused or put down.
Posted by Dinah on February 14, 2008, at 21:14:10
In reply to Re: blocked for 1 weekPhoenix1, posted by Justherself54 on February 14, 2008, at 20:04:42
I think it's great to be supportive of Phoenix1. And I agree that Phoenix1 is a supportive and informed poster, and hope to see him/her back on board after this week.
If someone were to tell me I was ugly, it might be the truth, but it wouldn't be allowable under the civility guidelines. Moreover, the perception of what is true varies among people. So "truth" does not exempt one from the civility guidelines.
"I feel" does not automatically make an "I" statement. An I statement is a statement about yourself, not about those other than yourself.
"I feel very very angry." is an "I" statement. It is a statement about yourself.
"I FEEL Phoenix1 has turned out to be one of the most supportive and informed posters and has helped me greatly." is a very supportive statement about Phoenix1, not an "I" statement.
Posted by 10derHeart on February 14, 2008, at 21:19:28
In reply to Supporting Phoenix1 » Justherself54, posted by Dinah on February 14, 2008, at 21:14:10
Posted by zazenducke on February 14, 2008, at 21:53:26
In reply to Supporting Phoenix1 » Justherself54, posted by Dinah on February 14, 2008, at 21:14:10
Is "I feel like a radioactive skunk at a sunday school party" a thought or a feeling?
I feel curious.
Posted by zazenducke on February 14, 2008, at 21:57:39
In reply to thought or feeling? » Dinah, posted by zazenducke on February 14, 2008, at 21:53:26
Posted by Dinah on February 14, 2008, at 22:04:48
In reply to thought or feeling? » Dinah, posted by zazenducke on February 14, 2008, at 21:53:26
It's an "I" statement, which would be the point as far as civility guidelines were concerned.
In a nonadministrative thought, my guess is that it would be a description of a feeling, since you probably don't mean you think you were a radioactive skunk? Even I feel angry is a thought about a feeling isn't it?
Posted by Dinah on February 14, 2008, at 22:10:34
In reply to OOPS above post for Deputy Dinah (nm) » zazenducke, posted by zazenducke on February 14, 2008, at 21:57:39
Please ignore all but the first line of the previous post.
Posted by Justherself54 on February 14, 2008, at 22:17:57
In reply to Supporting Phoenix1 » Justherself54, posted by Dinah on February 14, 2008, at 21:14:10
> I think it's great to be supportive of Phoenix1. And I agree that Phoenix1 is a supportive and informed poster, and hope to see him/her back on board after this week.
>
> If someone were to tell me I was ugly, it might be the truth, but it wouldn't be allowable under the civility guidelines. Moreover, the perception of what is true varies among people. So "truth" does not exempt one from the civility guidelines.
>
> "I feel" does not automatically make an "I" statement. An I statement is a statement about yourself, not about those other than yourself.
>
> "I feel very very angry." is an "I" statement. It is a statement about yourself.
>
> "I FEEL Phoenix1 has turned out to be one of the most supportive and informed posters and has helped me greatly." is a very supportive statement about Phoenix1, not an "I" statement.
>
>OK, this is where I get confused..how is "I feel Phoenix 1 etc." not an I statement..what I said is what I feel as it pertains to me..because he's supportive and informed I am helped by him..I don't get it..and I don't feel very good about being a part of Babble right now..
I know by being part of this website you have to abide by the rules..but I've felt this for a long time and I may get blocked for it, at this point I don't care..the administration of this site at times feels to me like judge and jury, handing down convictions but the defendants/accused have no right or recourse to appeal..I worked in the Justice system for 18 years where almost everything has an appeal process..so it's a bitter pill to swallow when I see this type of blocking happen..
That's all I'm going to say now, I think!
Posted by zazenducke on February 14, 2008, at 22:46:05
In reply to Re: Supporting Phoenix1, posted by Justherself54 on February 14, 2008, at 22:17:57
Posted by Toph on February 15, 2008, at 4:58:44
In reply to Blocked posters » Toph, posted by Dinah on February 14, 2008, at 21:02:55
> ... So even if someone is blocked for saying something, maybe even especially if someone is blocked for saying something, Babblers still have to be careful not to post anything that could lead them to feel accused or put down.
I see your point, although I thought the purpose of the admin sight was to have a board for the discussion of administration and it's rules. How then do we discuss infractions by another poster or are we only allowed to talk about our own infractions here (wait, that would be kind of tough if I were banned from posting for a year)?
Posted by Dinah on February 15, 2008, at 7:45:17
In reply to Re: Blocked posters » Dinah, posted by Toph on February 15, 2008, at 4:58:44
Dr. Bob has changed the rules here a bit, so that we're supposed to use the notify administrators function to report posts or posters.
Administration is for discussion of general problems now, not problems with particular posts.
But even before that, Dr. Bob discouraged negative comments about blocked posters or PBC's. I assume the idea is that the block or PBC is Admin response, and if you agree with that response, it doesn't need to be discussed administratively any further.
Not that it's not ok to support Administration. Just that Dr. Bob asks that we do so without negatively characterizing the posts of others.
Posted by gardenergirl on February 15, 2008, at 7:56:58
In reply to Re: Supporting Phoenix1, posted by Justherself54 on February 14, 2008, at 22:17:57
A poster who is blocked may appeal to Dr. Bob via email.
gg
Posted by Toph on February 15, 2008, at 8:40:36
In reply to Re: Blocked posters » Toph, posted by Dinah on February 15, 2008, at 7:45:17
I think I already know this stuff Dinah. My point is that it always seems so ironic and sad when a member of a mental health support forum gets severely punished instead of helped, but then I think you already know that also.
Posted by Dinah on February 15, 2008, at 9:13:50
In reply to Re: Blocked posters » Dinah, posted by Toph on February 15, 2008, at 8:40:36
I think there are inherent limitations to an internet bulletin board as a form of help. I know there are different ideas as to how to best use the format to the best advantage for the greatest amount of help to the greatest number of people. I think you and Dr. Bob both want the same end, although Dr. Bob's ideas may be different than yours about how to achieve it.
I think it's a shame that there are limitations, not just in this but in many other aspects. So many times I just really ache to help someone, but know that they need help IRL, and that an internet bulletin board, no matter how well intentioned, is not enough. That's not a comment on this circumstance, but just a general comment.
Posted by Toph on February 15, 2008, at 9:32:41
In reply to Re: Blocked posters » Toph, posted by Dinah on February 15, 2008, at 9:13:50
Posted by zazenducke on February 15, 2008, at 13:29:32
In reply to Re: Blocked posters » Toph, posted by Dinah on February 15, 2008, at 9:13:50
Do you remember how you felt in jr high?
I find it contemptible that bobbo puts you in the position to do to others what was done to you. But I still hold you equally responsible for the blocks you initiate. Deferring to bob for the actual sentence does not release you from that responsibility.
If you can't help at least don't actively harm.
"just following orders" is no defense
just a general comment
Posted by zazenducke on February 15, 2008, at 13:38:20
In reply to Re: Blocking posters » Dinah, posted by zazenducke on February 15, 2008, at 13:29:32
I was blocked by you dinah for six weeks for something I didn't do.
I told my doc my friend blocked me again and he said that bitch is NOT your friend and I said O she's not a bitch that's just dinah being dinah
but I'm tired of it
Verne makes me ashamed of all the twistedness I participate in here too.
bye
zazenskunke
Posted by zazenducke on February 15, 2008, at 14:48:37
In reply to Sorry...didn't mean to cause all this trouble. (nm) » Dr. Bob, posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on February 14, 2008, at 19:45:21
phillipines russia etc etc etc talk about multicultural
it's not that hard to get a woman!!!!!even one thast doesn't mind living with your momma
Posted by Deputy Racer on February 15, 2008, at 15:07:07
In reply to I statements, posted by zazenducke on February 15, 2008, at 13:38:20
>
>
> I told my doc my friend blocked me again and he said that bitch is NOT your friend and I said O she's not a bitch that's just dinah being dinah
>
>Please don't post anything which would lead someone to feel accused or put down, even if that person is a deputy here. Additionally, please don't bypass the asterisking system. Your last block was set at 11 weeks, and was up seven weeks ago by my count, so I'm currently doubling the length of that last block. I will also ask Dr Bob to review the block length, in case he'd like to revise it in either direction.
If you have any questions regarding the posting policies on this site, please read the FAQ, located at http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil Follow ups to this action should be directed to the Administration board and should themselves be civil.
Dr Bob has ultimate authority over all administrative issues on this site, and may choose at any time to revise or reverse any action taken by a deputy.
Deputy Racer
Posted by Dinah on February 15, 2008, at 19:12:11
In reply to I statements, posted by zazenducke on February 15, 2008, at 13:38:20
I hesitate to answer when you won't be able to respond for a while.
I do appreciate what you told your doctor.
And I do understand why you feel the way you do about me. I've never intended to hurt you, but I recognize that on occasion I have. I've tried to convey my regret and remorse for that.
But I have never intentionally blocked you for something you didn't do. I don't like blocking anyone, I don't like blocking you. I'm not saying I just follow orders. If I didn't believe that Dr. Bob was doing his best with Babble, I wouldn't serve as deputy. If I didn't think the civility guidelines were a good thing, I wouldn't be a deputy. But blocking people is not something I enjoy doing.
Like I said to Toph, sometimes two people can want the same thing. But because of different experiences and perceptions and because they're different people, how they consider the best way to achieve that can vary. You want Babble to be a safe place and so do I.
I don't want to jump to conclusions, but I've gotten the feeling over time that I've lost any positive regard you may have had for me. I've felt a great deal of sorrow for that over time. But my therapist has convinced me that sometimes there is nothing I can do beyond expressing regret, and remorse, and a desire that things be different. I have never lost my positive regard for you, even on those occasions I may feel angry or sad.
I'm not trying to get you to change your mind about me. But on my end, the door to being friends is always open. What you do with that is up to you.
Tone is hard to read in words. But while I may have a poor sense of humor and little whimsy, I am boringly earnest and generally mean what I say.
Take care of yourself, zazenducke.
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