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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 9 of 9. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Racer on January 12, 2004, at 14:29:41
OK, here's another of my rantings. This one is about what went on today in my psychotherapy session, and I'm looking for feedback. And the subject line is Lewis Carroll, for anyone who wondered what on earth I meant by it.
Anyway, today we talked about my attitude towards mental illness. We didn't get too deep into it, now that I think of it, but it did bring up a lot of roiling, bubbling stuffage inside me. Since I already know I'm not alone in most of my experiences, I figured someone here would have some insight that might help me settle myself a bit, so another Rant from Racer. (How does one get register a trademark? I think I should register Racer's Rants, don't you?)
Anyway, I know that mental illness is, generally speaking, like most other chronic illnesses. There's a genetic susceptibility, which can be triggered by exposure to certain stressors. Much like Type II Diabetes, which is expressed when the endocrine system is overstressed by lifestyle. OK, fine, I've got that part down pat. Mental illness is a medical condition, related to genetics and biochemistry and their interaction with the environment.
BUT
Then again, Type II Diabetes can be controlled, and its expression suppressed through lifestyle, as well. As in, if you are susceptible to it, you can exercise, eat a healthy, balanced diet, maintain a healthy weight, etc, and avoid becoming sick.
In other words, you can have a medical condition and guilt, too. (Who says you can't have it all, eh?)
Keep in mind that my family NEVER admitted to disease. To admit to illness was to show weakness, and a flawed character. My mother took this so far that she sent me to school with the mumps, and got upset when the school nurse called her to take me home. She also sent me to summer camp with chicken pox, and left me there. I grew up knowing that sickness of any kind was shameful, and never to acknowledge it.
With all that baggage, you can imagine how I react to my current situation, right? I sit and listen to my pdoc tell me that it's "appropriate to insulate myself from the stresses of the outside world, because I've been so sick," while I'm kicking myself for "malingering" instead of just getting on with it. Whatever "it" might be. And, of course, in deference to my mother's sensibilities, and in defense of myself against them, no one in the family beyond my mother and husband know anything about my current illness. As a result, I'm caught in that spot between trying to come to terms with all this, and having to hear the "suggestions" from many other family members about how to "fix" myself -- all forms of "Just get over it and get on with it." The problem is, since I grew up with all this anti-sickness philosophy, I can dish it out -- to myself -- as well as anyone else. And I do, oh, how I do beat myself up over my weakness and laziness and bad character!
So, for everyone of you who have been through similar processes, how did you handle it? For yourself, I mean, not for the other people around you? (I figure, first thing is I need to stop saying that they're right, then I can start to think about how to deflect the criticism from others. I figured that out all by myself, aren't you proud of me?) (Next step, after that, is to stop worrying about whether other people are proud of me and trying to get approval from others...)
You can probably tell I'm feeling a bit better. Lately, the physical discomfort from both drugs and stress has been so bad that any emotional response has been secondary. Since I've never been properly introduced to my emotions, I can only guess about whether or not my depression has improved.
Thanks to all of you for being exactly what Babble was supposed to be: a safe place to find support and volley ideas around.
Posted by shar on January 12, 2004, at 22:34:48
In reply to What I say three times IS TRUE (Racer Rant), posted by Racer on January 12, 2004, at 14:29:41
R,
You said "no one in the family beyond my mother and husband know anything about my current illness" and then "having to hear the "suggestions" from many other family members..." which sounds like others do know something about your illness (or maybe suspected illness? or past illness?).So, I'm confused about what you meant.
(And, I can't believe anyone would send a child to school with mumps!! and to summer camp with chicken pox!! That is in the abuse/neglect range, IMHO.)
Shar
Posted by Racer on January 13, 2004, at 1:12:20
In reply to Clarification? » Racer, posted by shar on January 12, 2004, at 22:34:48
Other members of my family don't know about how sick I was, or that I was hospitalized. Their comments are about my general failure in life, not anything specific. You know the sort of thing, "Just get a job, any job, and don't screw up enough to get fired this time!" That sort of thing. Mind you, none of them really know much about what I've done well in my life, and I have acheived things that I'm proud of, but their disdain and disapproval is so deeply ingrained into me, that I find myself internalizing their criticism. As I said, I'm harder on myself than anyone else could ever be.
As for the abuse/neglect part, that sort of thing wasn't really that bad, really. I certainly got better care at summer camp than I would have at home, and was happy to be there. Of course, now that I'm grown up, I wonder that they'd keep me there! It was just another of my mother's ways of expressing her own pathology, since if I got sick, it would reflect on her ability as a parent. In other words, I'm just another crazy member of my crazy family. Sure makes for great holidays, I guess...
Posted by judy1 on January 13, 2004, at 13:57:17
In reply to What I say three times IS TRUE (Racer Rant), posted by Racer on January 12, 2004, at 14:29:41
It sounds like intellectually you understand your illness and what it means to your lifestyle and how you have to cope with it. but emotionally, especially when you write about your family, it sounds like you and your therp have some work to do. we all want the approval of our parents, even when we recognize there is pathology there that doesn't prevent that overwhelming need. I've found that it helps me to look at someone else's situation, I'm much more objective and can say why do you need that person's approval after they abused you? (I'm going to have to agree with shar that your mom's actions when you were ill were abuse). notice I wrote that 'when I look at another person's situation :-)'. it is so much harder to change our own reactions, it's like the guilt is hard-wired, maybe it is? I guess all I can write is it's a very gradual process, one I think you've started simply by recognizing that it exists.
take care, judy
p.s. I really like 'racer's rants'
Posted by Racer on January 13, 2004, at 16:51:40
In reply to Re: What I say three times IS TRUE (Racer Rant) » Racer, posted by judy1 on January 13, 2004, at 13:57:17
Thanks, I'm glad you like the rants. They help me a lot, although I sometimes worry that I take up too much board space just ranting. I'm glad you enjoy them, helps ease the guilt.
What you say about it being easier to see other people than ourselves is so true. I can see what other people in my family do to themselves and each other, but as soon as it's directed at me, it becomes True, rather than just craziness. I saw a stand up comic years ago who hit the nail on the head: "The reason your parents are so good at pushing all your buttons is because they installed them!" Somehow, that makes it all sound so easy, doesn't it?
There's good and bad in most of the world, and certainly in my mother. The sickness thing is a special case, and I won't bore you by telling all about it here, but otherwise she did form my mind in a lot of very good ways, too. It means that now we can have the sort of highly enjoyable, gratifying conversations that I long for, and rarely find a partner in. We can throw ideas back and forth, clarifying them, building on them, and on subjects that we both enjoy. History, literature, art, criticism, and the modern world. Most recently, we analysed the current problems around us and decided the root cause is a lack of critical thinking. I enjoy that sort of conversation, not adversarial debate, but reasoned analysis refined by two good minds. (I told her it was a good thing for me I grew up around so many critical people, but she didn't laugh.)
Anyway, while I've certainly lost ground since before the Christmas Meltdown, at least I'm getting back to where I can start to worry out the tangled threads of my life again. Thank you for your response.
Posted by noa on January 18, 2004, at 11:41:42
In reply to What I say three times IS TRUE (Racer Rant), posted by Racer on January 12, 2004, at 14:29:41
Racer,
I still think the Diabetes analogy is a good one, but not necessarily to Type II Diabetes per se--more to the insulin dependent type, or perhaps a continuum of diabetes illness.
The reason I still think it's a good analogy is that there are people with diabetes who do have difficulty controlling it and managing it, even with a lot of effort in managing diet, weight exercise, medication, etc. Sometimes the medication puts the equilibrium out of whack, too.
The other thing you discussed was the SHAME. It's true. The shame of MI is a big factor. Which is why the diabetes analogy is used--to try to offset the shame and stigma.
It is hard to be totally rid of one's shame from what was learned within the family, etc. But perhaps you should not expect yourself to be totally free of it. This has always been my wish--to be totally free of the beleifs I have about myself that are unhealthy and harmful, and contribute to my depression and self-loathing. But I think I am coming to accept that these thoughts, as dysfunctional as they are, may be with me for the rest of my life. What I feel I may have more control over is how much power I give them, how much I listen to them, and what I can say to myself to quiet them. So they can be less active, less frequently noticeable, less influential, etc.
If you are still, as an adult, having to battle a totally unsupportive family system who continue to blame and shame, that is horse of a different color. Here, I believe the trick is to exercise some of the powers you have now that you did not have as a child, such as limiting your exposure to the toxic family influences, etc.
Take care.
Posted by shar on January 18, 2004, at 15:40:55
In reply to Re: What I say three times IS TRUE (Racer Rant) » Racer, posted by noa on January 18, 2004, at 11:41:42
Recently I had a session where I talked about feeling a lot of shame and my T asked "who is watching you?" and that was a good question. Later she talked about going about life as best I could without them 'looking over my shoulder.'
And, that's how it feels. Being watched. Even though it happens internally, it's almost always a response to how I think others perceive me: loser, failure, bad decision maker, lazy, lacking the character to will myself out of depression, etc.
So, visualizing them looking over my shoulder, and perhaps making some of their erudite comments (ha), helps me draw a much stronger boundary about where my energy should be going.
Shar
Posted by noa on January 19, 2004, at 7:55:29
In reply to The Shame Part, posted by shar on January 18, 2004, at 15:40:55
Thanks, Shar. That is really interesting. I'll have to try that, too.
Posted by Racer on January 19, 2004, at 20:25:18
In reply to The Shame Part, posted by shar on January 18, 2004, at 15:40:55
That's a good one, Shar. Who *is* looking over my shoulder? I'm not sure, but imagining it from that point of view might help me. I know that that is part of my problem, that I do feel as if there are external standards I *must* attain, whether or not they reflect my internal standards. Maybe if I think about who it is who's setting those standards, I'll find out what my own standards might be?
Thanks!
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