Posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on September 2, 2008, at 8:16:51
In reply to Re: socialist expectations » caraher, posted by rayww on September 1, 2008, at 10:59:32
> > Some people use the word "socialist" as if that were a bad thing...
>
> Democracy was only meant to work if people followed the rules, of their own will, not being told. Look at the mess our democracy has gotten us into. Then we try to correct it with socialism, and we suddenly find we are on a slippery slope to Communism.
>
> Those who wrote the constitution (US) were steeped in European tradition. They were fully aware of what can happen if someone gets power hungry, and they tried to protect US from that in the constitution.
>
> Progressives think the constitution is evolutional, that it should "grow" with the times. I, for one, believe the US constitution was inspired of God for our day, and that as imperfect a system as democracy is, it is still better than any other alternative.
>
>Ray:
The term "Communist" that countries like China and the former USSR labeled themselves as where anything BUT Communist. They where more like a right-wing quasi-fascist dictatorship. I've read the works of Engels and Marx, and they are very, very different from what any of the above nations turned out to be. One of the final outcomes of Marxism is abolishment of the state in it's entirety. The middle class becomes 'the' class, and just carries on independently. Funny that reduction of government just happens to be a right-wing issue as well..lol.
True Marxist socialism has *never* been carried out, but many of it's ideas can be found in European countries which have progressive "social democracy". There is more then one type of democracy. Europeans have some of the best quality-of-life standards in the world. I think it is time us N. Americans look that way.
Jay
poster:Jay_Bravest_Face
thread:849319
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/poli/20080728/msgs/849857.html