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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 6 of 6. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by David Smith on October 6, 2003, at 23:58:45
My counselor terminated me four months ago. We talked about the termination and she told me that seeing her as a mother figure was the reason behind it. My transference was wrong. But the other day as I was looking into my medical files I discovered that she didn't let me go because i saw her as a mother figure (therefore she lied to me) but because she wrote, "I wanted a HOMOSEXUAL relationship with her". Who gives her that right to assume this SHIT? And if it was right, which it isn't, who gives her a right to be revealing my SEXUALITY? Please somebody tell me, is this legal?
still hurting
Posted by Dr. Bob on October 9, 2003, at 3:02:18
In reply to Betrayal by counselor (from still hurting), posted by David Smith on October 6, 2003, at 23:58:45
> Who gives her that right to assume this SH*T?
You may be angry, but please don't use language that could offend others, thanks.
Bob
Posted by Dr. Bob on October 9, 2003, at 3:12:17
In reply to Betrayal by counselor (from still hurting), posted by David Smith on October 6, 2003, at 23:58:45
BTW, transference is not uncommon. (nm)
Posted by David Smith on October 6, 2003, at 23:26:41
In reply to http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/20031004/msgs/266162.html
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Re: Is what my counselor did right???
Posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 23:29:56
In reply to Re: Is what my counselor did right???, posted by Pete C. on October 6, 2003, at 22:24:03
Yes, that's what's bothering me. We sat there for months talking about honesty and integrity and here she lied to me about the simple topic of why she terminated me. I could have accepted her opinion and at least thrown it out. But to have lied about it gave me no power at all. Secondly, yes she is a counselor. And her notes were sent to my doctor. That's why I'm also upset. Because her assuming I'm gay is one thing, but to tell my doctor that, is another thing.
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Re: Is what my counselor did right???
Posted by David Smith on October 6, 2003, at 23:43:23
In reply to Re: Is what my counselor did right???, posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 23:29:56
> Yes, that's what's bothering me. We sat there for months talking about honesty and integrity and here she lied to me about the simple topic of why she terminated me. I could have accepted her opinion and at least thrown it out. But to have lied about it gave me no power at all. Secondly, yes she is a counselor. And her notes were sent to my doctor. That's why I'm also upset. Because her assuming I'm gay is one thing, but to tell my doctor that, is another thing.
This is serious. That information could follow you for life and may even affect the treatment you receive. Talk to your doctor about having the note removed immediately. You should also check your other medical files (including insurance files) to ensure your privacy is maintained. I hope you call tomorrow.
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Let's go to Psych/social » Still Hurting
Posted by David Smith on October 7, 2003, at 0:07:41
In reply to Re: Is what my counselor did right???, posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 23:29:56
> Yes, that's what's bothering me. We sat there for months talking about honesty and integrity and here she lied to me about the simple topic of why she terminated me. I could have accepted her opinion and at least thrown it out. But to have lied about it gave me no power at all. Secondly, yes she is a counselor. And her notes were sent to my doctor. That's why I'm also upset. Because her assuming I'm gay is one thing, but to tell my doctor that, is another thing.
There is no question that what she did was inappropriate AND insensitive. I don't detect any malice here though. I have to ask this:What if her deductions are correct? Is that what is really bothering you?
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Re: BTW, transference is not uncommon.
Posted by David Smith on October 7, 2003, at 0:31:14
In reply to BTW, transference is not uncommon. (nm), posted by David Smith on October 6, 2003, at 23:26:41
Here is a great thread on "Babble."
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/psycho/20030711/msgs/245650.html
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Re: Is what my counselor did right??? » Still Hurting
Posted by galkeepinon on October 7, 2003, at 2:07:37
In reply to Is what my counselor did right???, posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 21:57:21
When you're counselor told you the reason of termination being 'seeing her as a mother figure'
If she was a *good* therapist, I would think that she would have worked with you on that issue, I've had several therapists who helped me deal with 'mother-figure issues'.
Your transference wasn't *right or wrong*, in my opinion, try not to take the blame.
Therapy is about issues like this, it took me a very long time to know that the only place I would find a mother was inside my heart. One really wise therapist pointed that out to me in March 2002.
Not easy a lot of the times, but I love my mother and I respect her. Life is short. (this is just my opinon and feedback)
Anyway, as far as legality is concerned, you can request your medical records from her, depending where you are, and view them. If you showed that 'I wanted a HOMOSEXUAL relationship with her' was not the case, and if you know in your heart, don't put up with that!!! No Way!! Your therapist can document your 'sexual preference' if she chooses to, if you told her, and she did.
**You can always call her up or go see her face to face and ask her why she documented that. It depends on how you will feel if you choose to do that.
Hang in there, I hope you get some answers, closure AND what you're needing:-)
Take care,
Kristen
> My counselor terminated me four months ago. We talked about the termination and she told me that seeing her as a mother figure was the reason behind it. My transference was wrong. But the other day as I was looking into my medical files I discovered that she didn't let me go because i saw her as a mother figure (therefore she lied to me) but because she wrote, "I wanted a HOMOSEXUAL relationship with her". Who gives her that right to assume this SHIT? And if it was right, which it isn't, who gives her a right to be revealing my SEXUALITY? Please somebody tell me, is this legal?----
Lying » Pete C.
Posted by galkeepinon on October 7, 2003, at 2:11:26
In reply to Re: Is what my counselor did right???, posted by Pete C. on October 6, 2003, at 22:24:03
>>>>I think it is the fact that she lied about why she terminated the sessions that is bothering you.
I would be very upset if that were the case, believe me I have been part of lies, and I really think she owes you an explanation, but ask for it, she can't read your mind, and maybe it's not even bothering her, but it's bothering YOU, and that's what's important. Do what you need to, if you can, to get it straight with her~that's all you can do...
Good luck!----
Re: Is what my counselor did right???
Posted by jay on October 7, 2003, at 7:49:00
In reply to Is what my counselor did right???, posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 21:57:21
> My counselor terminated me four months ago. We talked about the termination and she told me that seeing her as a mother figure was the reason behind it. My transference was wrong. But the other day as I was looking into my medical files I discovered that she didn't let me go because i saw her as a mother figure (therefore she lied to >me) but because she wrote, "I wanted a >HOMOSEXUAL >relationship with her". Who gives >her that right >to assume this SHIT? And if it >was right, which >it isn't, who gives her a >right to be >revealing >my SEXUALITY? Please >somebody tell me, >is this legal?
Hi:Sorry you are so distressed over this. It may seem dramatic to you, but it is not the labels that count. Besides, not to belittle your values and beliefs, but in science (i.e. psychiatry, social work), homosexuality/bisexuality are not considered *bad*, *wrong*, or anything abnormal. I really don't want to argue this, but it is just a stance medical science and the APA take.
Another important factor, which others seem to agree on, is what I have come up against in counselling, and that is transference. It can make even the most comfortable of therapists uneasy. It actually feels like "teeth-pulling" to a therapist, especially how vulnerable to lawsuits, malpractice, etc, they are. Just a suggestion, but you may want to try to find a good counsellor who specializes in helping you build your own walls to keep separation and understanding of the different types of 'roles' and actions we should use when dealing with various people. (i.e. how you act around a partner compared to a stranger and/or a therapist.) There may be a whole bag of other issues I am not aware of, but you also have to understand that all of this may be part of your illness. If your symptoms aren't getting treated by medication, maybe it is time to seek further or different meds.
I hope the best for you...
Sincerely,
Jay----
Re: Is what my counselor did right??? » Pete C.
Posted by Dinah on October 7, 2003, at 17:40:52
In reply to Re: Is what my counselor did right???, posted by Pete C. on October 6, 2003, at 22:24:03
> From what you wrote is seems your counselor did the right thing by ending your sessions. Most professionals will if they sense any sort of emotional attachment from the patient. She could have mistaken your feelings of mother figure as you comming on to her.
Most professionals with even a rudimentary training in transference would never dream of terminating a client because they sense emotional attachment from them. A tradionally trained therapist will consider it part of the therapeutic process. A CBT therapist may not "do" transference, but should at least have a passing knowledge of how to deal with it with empathy and skill.
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Re: Is what my counselor did right???
Posted by loolot on October 7, 2003, at 18:54:29
In reply to Re: Is what my counselor did right???, posted by Pete C. on October 6, 2003, at 22:24:03
Transference is normal in patient/therapist relationship. A good therapist will work with the emotional attachment and go into it to reveal other things in the session. This is not a normal thing to dump a patient for. In fact, I think it is wrong and could be unethical. Maybe she had to say homosexual in the files because it is against the rules to leave a patient for something else
Maybe this therapist might be freaking out about her own transference?
Posted by Dr. Bob on October 9, 2003, at 3:20:37
In reply to Betrayal by counselor (from still hurting), posted by David Smith on October 6, 2003, at 23:58:45
Should I or should I not???
Posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 22:11:13
I recently discovered my counselor's address and telephone number. As my name states, I am still hurting over the way she disguarded me like a piece of trash when she realized that my transference was too great for her to handle. I don't know how to really handle my pain and hurt. One thought is to try to let it all go. That would be to forgive. Yet, another side of me wants to use this information to make her life as painful as she's caused me. Should I or should I not??
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Re: Should I or should I not???
Posted by Pete C. on October 6, 2003, at 22:29:46
In reply to Should I or should I not???, posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 22:11:13
How did she hurt you?
Do not do anything to hurt her in any way. As much as you want to get back at her, if you do anything to her you probably wouldn't get away with it to begin with since you posted on this board. I do not know if law states that Dr. Bob has to inform the law if intent to harm someone is posted on his website (Him being a doctor whom is bound to such things). But if he does getting your IP and tracing you back to the general location is very easy.
How long have you known for? Is this causing you suffering where you work or attend school?
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Re: Should I or should I not???
Posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 23:51:38
In reply to Re: Should I or should I not???, posted by Pete C. on October 6, 2003, at 22:29:46
Thanks for the warning. I wouldn't physically harm her.
I was hurt because I told her everything. I swear I was more intimate with her than anybody I've ever told my life to. And she vowed to me that she would never leave and reject me as other people have done in the past. She told me that she was safe and I could trust her. So I opened up my heart, my mind, my psyche, to her. I didn't hold back anything. I was looking to her to get help from all my issues. And then out of NOWHERE she pulled the plug on me and terminated my services. It was over. I couldn't call her to find out what happened or anything. I felt used, abused, abandoned. I felt like trash. How do you open up your life so intimately with someone to have them just throw you away. That hurt like hell. And especially because she knew my fear of rejection is what hurts me so bad. She saw my fears and guaranteed me that I could open my soul up to her. But she handled me like everybody else has. Don't you think she should feel some kind of pain for what she did to me? I wouldn't hurt her physically. I want to get over this drama. But I did love her. I don't know how I loved her. But somewhere in all this, I want to hear her say I'm sorry. And because I know that I'll never hear those words, I want to use her telephone number to harass her. I probably won't. But my pain tells me to.----
Re: Should I or should I not??? » Still Hurting
Posted by David Smith on October 6, 2003, at 23:55:18
In reply to Should I or should I not???, posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 22:11:13
> I recently discovered my counselor's address and telephone number. As my name states, I am still hurting over the way she disguarded me like a piece of trash when she realized that my transference was too great for her to handle. I don't know how to really handle my pain and hurt. One thought is to try to let it all go. That would be to forgive. Yet, another side of me wants to use this information to make her life as painful as she's caused me. Should I or should I not??
Revenge is often unsatisfying. Try LOVE. It hurts more (oops- that was bitter).You should probably talk to your former counselor when you calm down. What is your real goal here? Do you want to feel hurt? Are you angry at your mother and taking it out on her? You CAN control the situation.
This should really be at psych/ social.
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Re: Should I or should I not???
Posted by Pete C. on October 7, 2003, at 0:10:48
In reply to Re: Should I or should I not???, posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 23:51:38
Harrassment will only lead to more pain. For one she could sue you and second you won't get the result you wanted. She'll pull further away from you and you'll totally ruin any chance of making up.
I would call her at her professional location and ask why she lied to you. And since they are your medical files you can add anything you would like. I would write down all this and include them in your files.
To me from what I have read it seems this counseler handled things very very poorly. Not only did she make herself appear as someone who you could have initmate conversations/feelings with. When she felt things getting way out of hand she terminated you and lied to you. As support people they can not get in those situations (Where their patients have such feelings for them) but it seems like instead of trying to handle it she took the easy way out and just terminated you.
Also if I may ask why did her records goto your doctor?
You said that she was a professional councilor so I assume she did the normal scpeal about "Everything is confidental unless you might harm yourself or another person". Even though your doctor has his own confidentality, the councilor can't just hand over those files without your express written concent. Even insurrence companies are not allow to have medical files disclosed without the permission of the issuerd.I am assuming that this doctor you mention is the replacement of the counciler?
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Re: Should I or should I not???
Posted by David Smith on October 7, 2003, at 0:17:14
In reply to Re: Should I or should I not???, posted by Pete C. on October 7, 2003, at 0:10:48
http://dr-bob.org/babble/social/20031002/msgs/266172.html
Hey Pete!
We all sign consent forms without thinking about it. Otherwise, treatment does not usually begin.
Some therapists use transference to augment the therapeutic process. It takes skill. Still Hurting is better off without this therapist in the long run.----
Re: Should I or should I not??? » Still Hurting
Posted by BekkaH on October 7, 2003, at 0:50:57
In reply to Re: Should I or should I not???, posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 23:51:38
No, you should NOT try to "get back at" your former counselor, although I can certainly see why you feel so hurt and angry. Your former counselor sounds like a very unprofessional, uninformed, and inexperienced therapist. Patients are supposed to become attached to their therapists. That's what the transference is all about. Apparently the counselor was too inexperienced to handle your transference, or perhaps she had too much of her own "baggage" to deal with. I don't know what country you're in, but in the U.S., I'm pretty sure that a therapist would have to refer you to someone else if they were unable to help you; however, from what you've said about her, I wouldn't want her to recommend anyone else. She might refer you to someone as inexperienced and incompetent as she is. Sometimes patients have "erotic transferences" toward their therapists. That does NOT mean the patient is a homosexual. A highly skilled therapist (male or female) should have learned how to handle erotic transferences appropriately; apparently your former counselor was unskilled. Perhaps you did not have an "erotic transference." Perhaps you just wanted to feel close to someone who was kind to you.
Please find another therapist so you can get over the hurt and get on with your life. Do NOT call the previous therapist, and do NOT try to retaliate. Remember the saying: "Living well is the best revenge."
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Re: Should I or should I not???
Posted by Pete C. on October 7, 2003, at 2:29:10
In reply to Re: Should I or should I not???, posted by David Smith on October 7, 2003, at 0:17:14
Yes we sign consent forms to see people for treatment but i'm talking medical release forms. The only forms I have ever signed have been for insurrence. And since this isn't a therapist from what i've read it was a councilor which makes me believe it might be a school. Even as such they CANNOT release any such forms with out the express written concent of the patient. I was in a car accident a while back and the insurence wanted ALL current medical files on me for payment. I had to sign like 10 medical release forms each one bascially stating which files woudl be released and only from which doctors. I had to sign one for my Pdoc also because of medication issues that arrose.
Now what i'm curious about is if this consuler gave out files or spoke to people iwhtout your concent stating not only that you might be homosexual but ANYTHING related to your case. If they were bound by medical law then they are liable and you could sue, if they arn't bound then it could be considered slander and you could sue.
But from what i've read I dont' think this is the case at all. I have a feeling you had your files transfered (which requires concent) to a doctor and they informed you of what she wrote.
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Re: Should I or should I not???
Posted by Pete C. on October 7, 2003, at 2:30:45
In reply to Should I or should I not???, posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 22:11:13
Still hurting.
Was she a theripist, pdoc or a counciler. I can't speak for others but it makes a difference on how I would view the person that terminated u.
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Re: Should I or should I not??? » Pete C.
Posted by Still Hurting on October 7, 2003, at 15:43:46
In reply to Re: Should I or should I not???, posted by Pete C. on October 7, 2003, at 0:10:48
Yes Pete, she sent it to the doctor because he became the replacement counselor/doctor.
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Re: Should I or should I not??? » Still Hurting
Posted by Dinah on October 7, 2003, at 17:34:56
In reply to Should I or should I not???, posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 22:11:13
No, you shouldn't do anything to her privately, such as harass her. But I don't think it would be out of line to contact her professional licensing board to suggest she needs more training. And don't worry about any homosexual overtones. Even heterosexual people develop erotic transferences on their same sex therapists. If someone does see your file, no one will jump to any conclusions about your sexual preference even if they do believe the counselor.
Talk it over with your current therapist (although I understand your lack of trust). And you might want to use the links at the top of the page to go over to Psychological Babble, where transference is discussed on a regular basis.
A competent therapist should be able to deal with transference.
I also suggest the book "In Session" by Deborah Lott. It's a great book on transference.
You have every right to be angry, but don't let your anger cause you to do something that will be harmful to you. Having that note in your file will probably never harm you a bit. Having a harassment charge against you will.
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Stillhurting, Re: Should I or should I not???
Posted by McPac on October 7, 2003, at 22:31:03
In reply to Should I or should I not???, posted by Still Hurting on October 6, 2003, at 22:11:13
Go For It!!!!
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Re: Stillhurting, Re: Should I or should I not???
Posted by McPac on October 7, 2003, at 22:42:25
In reply to Stillhurting, Re: Should I or should I not???, posted by McPac on October 7, 2003, at 22:31:03
Still,
I was NOT implying doing ANYTHING illegal of course.
Posted by Dinah on October 9, 2003, at 7:40:09
In reply to Redirected: Should I or should I not???, posted by Dr. Bob on October 9, 2003, at 3:20:37
Posted by Dr. Bob on October 10, 2003, at 1:00:47
In reply to Re: Ummmm. Remember Psychological Babble? (nm) » Dr. Bob, posted by Dinah on October 9, 2003, at 7:40:09
This is the end of the thread.
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