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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Dinah on November 18, 2007, at 14:54:28
I think I am growing. I refuse to say growing up. But I think I have been dragged kicking and screaming into personal growth.
Would it be childish of me to say that I'm not altogether happy about it?
Posted by Muffled on November 18, 2007, at 15:19:02
In reply to Will I or Nill I, posted by Dinah on November 18, 2007, at 14:54:28
Posted by Angela2 on November 18, 2007, at 16:31:30
In reply to Will I or Nill I, posted by Dinah on November 18, 2007, at 14:54:28
I would think that's a good thing, but I understand resistance to change. If that's what that is.
Posted by Muffled on November 18, 2007, at 17:58:01
In reply to Will I or Nill I, posted by Dinah on November 18, 2007, at 14:54:28
Posted by DAisym on November 18, 2007, at 18:52:12
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I, posted by Angela2 on November 18, 2007, at 16:31:30
I think growth can be painful (growing pains) because for every gain there is usually some loss involved. Hopefully the gain will outweigh the loss.
Just like new love is wonderful - it is all consuming, passionate and exciting, it must, by definition, stop being new at some point. Then hopefully it will evolve into something that is fulfilling and stable and soothing. But I think we are sad for the loss of excitement and all consuming nature of it.
Maybe this is a stupid example. It just came to mind for me. Kind of like I feel about having emotions. I think I functioned better without the awareness.
Posted by Phillipa on November 18, 2007, at 20:12:59
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I, posted by DAisym on November 18, 2007, at 18:52:12
Dinah you are very strong hence the difficulty in changing. I'd like to be young again and I can't impossible. I need to learn to accept the changes not easy but neccessary. Phillipa
Posted by seldomseen on November 19, 2007, at 6:35:39
In reply to Will I or Nill I, posted by Dinah on November 18, 2007, at 14:54:28
Sometimes I think personal growth is very overrated, but darnit - sometimes it just sneaks up on us.
As far as growing up, well I think only an adult can wish to be a child.
Good luck. I hope things get to stay exactly as they are with you and that you can escape any more of that nasty personal growth. ;)
Take care
Seldom.
Posted by star008 on November 19, 2007, at 8:35:39
In reply to Will I or Nill I, posted by Dinah on November 18, 2007, at 14:54:28
I have been dragged along to and haven't been too happy about it either..Why is that? we should be happy to grow and maybe find contentment or some lasting happiness.. Is it because the change might leave you feeling like you are losing a part of yourself even though that part keeps you stuck?? Like, who will I be if I grow?? This is all I know.
Posted by Dinah on November 19, 2007, at 9:53:31
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I, posted by star008 on November 19, 2007, at 8:35:39
I think, to me, growing up has very negative connotations. It does mean losing a part of myself, or losing aspects of myself that I find special and valuable. Growing up seems to me to mean thinking with my head. Being rational and sensible.
And I'm all of those things enough. Why is it needful to be that way more? It's not a very happy way to live life. Maybe not as many lows, but not as much attachment or happiness or any of those things.
It seems to me that growing up brings a certain amount of separation and detachment. And I hate those things. I want to merge, even if it's only in my own mind. Even if it isn't a "true" version of reality. I don't want to be separate. It's too lonely.
I want to believe in magic, because magic makes me feel safe and protected. It's too scary to not believe in magic.
That's why I will not use the term growing up at all. But... growing seems lonely too.
Posted by Dinah on November 19, 2007, at 9:54:03
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I » star008, posted by Dinah on November 19, 2007, at 9:53:31
Posted by Muffled on November 19, 2007, at 12:21:15
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I » star008, posted by Dinah on November 19, 2007, at 9:53:31
Growing up NOT bad Dinah.
Maturation brings more peace.
We can settle into our own natural selves.
We can be competant, but we DO NOT lose the other.
It is just more controlled, but still accessable.
The joy is still there.
M
Posted by star008 on November 19, 2007, at 22:27:42
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I, posted by Muffled on November 19, 2007, at 12:21:15
Dinah,
I think we just don't understand because we have not "grown up" yet.. It is a natural human design, (to grow and change).. We are meant for growth. We will adapt and find it is better..At least I think we will but I know how you feel.. I don't want to grow either. You know, as miserable as I am most of the time I don't want to let go of my depression, (not totally).. nuts, isn't it??
Who will I be?? What will I do?? Life will expect so much more of me when and if I am "balanced". Why in the world would I want to hang on?? to punish myself?? to be caught up in the drama of being depressed and wanting to leave?? Makes no sense at all really.
Posted by Dinah on November 19, 2007, at 22:35:44
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I, posted by Muffled on November 19, 2007, at 12:21:15
I know there are good things involved. But to me they don't outweigh the loneliness.
I hate separation and individuation.
Posted by Dinah on November 19, 2007, at 22:39:06
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I, posted by star008 on November 19, 2007, at 22:27:42
I don't think I want to hold on to the bad things. I think I want to hold on to the good things. Like the belief that no matter what happens mommy and daddy will make sure everything is ok. I think I moved that expectation to my therapist, but I liked leaving it at that. Yeah, it hurt sometimes. But more often it made me feel warm and safe and protected. And at some level I knew it wasn't even true. But that didn't matter.
I think it's time for a good two or three steps straight back.
Posted by star008 on November 19, 2007, at 23:00:47
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I » Muffled, posted by Dinah on November 19, 2007, at 22:35:44
I don't think there will seperation or loneliness with growth.. It is just something new, with new things. You will adjust and things will integrate and maybe you won't even notice you grew until you have done it!! That is how alot of it goes... take care
Posted by Dinah on November 19, 2007, at 23:16:52
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I, posted by star008 on November 19, 2007, at 23:00:47
But still....
there's no getting around the fact that separation and individuation involve
separation
and
individuation
By definition that involves separation. And individuation.
How can they call something good that even by its own name sounds *bad*. And lonely.
I don't want to be an individual. I want to be able to curl up inside someone and be safe.
Posted by star008 on November 19, 2007, at 23:28:20
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I » star008, posted by Dinah on November 19, 2007, at 23:16:52
I would like to crawl up and be safe too Dinah. I am sorry for your pain.. I know how you feel.. But in the end it is only you.. Sounds lonely to me too but in the end that is how it is supposed to be.. I don't know how to be happy with it either.
hugs
Posted by Dinah on November 19, 2007, at 23:41:04
In reply to Re: Will I or Nill I, posted by star008 on November 19, 2007, at 23:28:20
I was just considering what tomorrow's session might be like. I'd stomp in and fold my arms and say I *hate* separation and individuation and I don't ever want to have to do it. And my therapist will smile with recognition and say "I know" then gently ask "So who said you needed to individuate?"
And met with such lack of resistance, my pushing will land me in a pile a few steps forward.
This is the end of the thread.
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