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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 16 to 40 of 50. Go back in thread:
Posted by floatingbridge on August 8, 2011, at 21:51:32
In reply to Re: A cultural Chernobyl, posted by sigismund on August 8, 2011, at 20:43:12
> I believe, but cannot know or prove, that if the elites had shown more decency and principle, there would be less rioting generally.
>
> Someone Pullman, the kids author, has started a committee in the UK, something about how they have been taken over by A FERAL ELITE and the idea is to bring decency back into politics.
>
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2011/jul/31/public-jury-
campaign-feral-elite
Wow. That is some coinage. That is truly an amazing phrase. Thank you for the link.
About Pullman's fiction:The third part of the His Dark Materials trilogy, The Amber Spyglass, was the first 'children's book' to win the Whitbread prize. The trilogy was widely acclaimed for its gripping plot, absorbing characters, richly inventive imaginative landscape and fearless exploration of big ideas, from the nature of hell to the existence, or otherwise, of God. Some critics, however, found the third volume baggier than the previous two. The only sour note came from the religious lobby, with the Catholic Herald describing his work as "truly the stuff of nightmares... worthy of the bonfire." Not surprising, given Pullman's hatred of organised religion and his statement that "I am all for the death of God." Yet he is a firm believer that writers have a duty to tackle the great moral questions, and it is his ability to do this in such a rich and versatile manner that elevates his work above the fantasy or genre pigeonholes.
Posted by sigismund on August 8, 2011, at 23:12:56
In reply to A feral elite » sigismund, posted by floatingbridge on August 8, 2011, at 21:51:32
I have always been interested in and vaguely sympathetic to religions, feeling that they are like languages of the spirit and worth preserving in a similar way.
I have just finished listening to a religion program which featured John Lennox, Oxford professor of mathematics talking about Hitchins and Dawkins, though really I have been so unimpressed by that form of atheism and agreed with the German professor he mentioned who said that they are seen there as simply to trivial to mention (they having a different experience of atheism). If there is any sense in this, it comes from something like osmosis, because I have not read any Dawkins since The Blind Watchmaker, which I didn't much like, and he seems to have got worse.
Even so, the plague of our times is fundamentalism, of every stripe.
What was this in aid of?
Posted by floatingbridge on August 9, 2011, at 5:34:10
In reply to Re: A feral elite » floatingbridge, posted by sigismund on August 8, 2011, at 23:12:56
I have listened to both Hawkins and I think Hitchins, though the last name I am not sure about, another devout atheist, and even I overturned them in my thinking, being myself absolutely under read in any sort of philosophic thought.
I admit to an initial titillation with Dawkins only because I was force fed religion as a child and spiritually invalidated in the process.
I have mentioned Stephen Fry before, and he may be quite soft as far as a thinker goes, I don't know, but he is far more reverent regarding the role of religion, though he absolutely bashes the Catholic Church while upholding the respect of individual practioners. I found him on YouTube looking at bipolar topics (seems he has cyclothymia, my first dx). He's like listening to a really brainy friend hold forth.
A concern, in my akward paraphrase is that the new atheists have only taken up a contrary position and left the very human driven roots of religion unexamined. Fry is into the Enlightenment and science and mystery and imagination.
He also said something I recall is that it is every thinking person's duty to, regardless of belief, to imagine the possibility that there is no afterlife just to see what that would do to their thinking and decision making, though he seems alright with someone having a belief in an afterlife. He speaks about the institutional cruelties perpetuated by both extremes.
3:30 am ramblings.
Posted by sigismund on August 9, 2011, at 14:31:07
In reply to Re: A cultural Chernobyl » floatingbridge, posted by sigismund on August 8, 2011, at 20:24:07
>>What provoked them?
Look how they have spread. Bit of a problem of social cohesion, from the looks of it. Impossible to imagine this in war time or post war Britain.
Blair is particularly interesting. I don't know enough about him. I find him worse than Bush....fewer excuses, more narcissism. But I don't know enough.
Thatcher said 'There is no such thing as society', and she seems to have been proved right by the march of events, but she would not like the mobs breaking into her house and ransacking it.
Our leaders really bother me. One of the wikileaks docs was about Kevin Rudd advising Hilary Clinton to (if I am not wrong) wage war on China under certain scenarios. Australia has this terribly tedious thing about punching above its weight, but even so.........how could he? The ALP?
Posted by sigismund on August 9, 2011, at 14:39:35
In reply to Re: A cultural Chernobyl, posted by sigismund on August 9, 2011, at 14:31:07
This is really dreadful,or indiscreet or something. There must be better ways to express concern than this.
Posted by sigismund on August 9, 2011, at 14:42:05
In reply to Re: A cultural Chernobyl, posted by sigismund on August 9, 2011, at 14:39:35
I mean, really! It is actually quite funny in a terrible way.
>But Attorney-General Robert McClelland said the leak would not affect growing ties with China, which has become Australias largest trading partner as it imports natural resources to feed its booming economy.
>We have a very strong relationship with China and that arrangement will continue, McClelland told journalists.
>There was no immediate response from Beijing.
>Australia has a robust relationship with China, Rudd said Monday, and would not contact Beijing over the cable.
Posted by floatingbridge on August 9, 2011, at 16:22:54
In reply to Re: A cultural Chernobyl, posted by sigismund on August 9, 2011, at 14:39:35
"Then-Australian leader Kevin Rudd told the United States it should be prepared to use force against China if everything goes wrong, a US diplomatic cable released by WikiLeaks reveals."
The "if everything goes wrong parts" alarms me.
Interesting. I see what you mean, maybe about Rudd, and what you have mentioned before about Australia punching above it's weight. I read this as Rudd hedging alliances to China and the US. It strikes me as driven by a fearful vulnerability. Then again, if Australia is being used as a mining resource....
Posted by sigismund on August 9, 2011, at 16:50:02
In reply to Clinton/Rudd » sigismund, posted by floatingbridge on August 9, 2011, at 16:22:54
It may become a really difficult dangerous situation where Australia is in a bind, so it needs to be very carefully managed.
Rudd was really silly. Beating his chest, really.
Everything said in these situations needs to be said as if it could be overheard.
Posted by sigismund on August 10, 2011, at 9:08:00
In reply to Re: A feral elite » sigismund, posted by floatingbridge on August 9, 2011, at 5:34:10
The political debate has to emphasise the criminality of the riots. But the way it has spread so easily makes me see it as a reflection of the appalling behaviour of our elites. Australia has been lucky. I wouldn't be saying this about Howard, even though I disagreed with him. But the standards in the UK have been dragged through the mud. I'm thinking of the culture of impunity mainly. Murdoch is part of it. Those feral elites. And the hooray henries for whom life is a game. All in the name of classlessness too. Everyone knows lots of things. All that crap Blair kept talking about Iraq. Inquiry after inquiry. It doesn't matter how many damn inquiries. That doesn't make it look any better. The problem is my generation. Maybe Blair is younger? We need to be replaced by people who think better and differently.
Posted by floatingbridge on August 10, 2011, at 10:12:26
In reply to Re: A feral elite, posted by sigismund on August 10, 2011, at 9:08:00
Maybe younger, but not sure, sigi. The inquiry after inquiry thing seems to lead no where except somewhere very obscure. But I have seen countless inquiries bring any real crime to naught.
Then we had to impeach our thinking, activated president here (Clinton). How can I not despair? Even my mom who watched Fox tv 24/7 was embarrassed by those preceedings. Like myself, she had never traveled, and only read crime novels. She said one day, the French must think we are so
ridiculous how we go on and on about the dna on Monica Lewinski's dress.There are men and women of your and my generation who
have excellent ideas who have been shouted down. I have seen Gore shouted down. The gentleman you quoted,
Andrew B. was certainly ridiculed if he spoke out against the war. Anyone was. But I have complained before I believe
meaningful discussion no longer takes place in my country.I hope I am using enough I statements here.
I have been a mom long enough to see the linguistic complexities and maneuverings that arise around cleaning legos off the floor....
Back on point, regarding criminality, it is easier to discuss
and treat crime rather than the causes. My country spends lavishly on the penal system. The corporate looters get off while UK kids are smashing windows and grabbing their
knock-off luxury goods and status symbols. A great diversion. I don't say that lightly. I dispise the waste of youth on criminality. I despair. I remember the LA riots. But there is such racial tension in our country. And disparity.With the emphasis on criminality, I come round again to
the idea of a police action sparking both riots. Because the police are supposed to, I think in old mythology, work for the citizenry. But they are really the arms of a higher power. So, yeah, let's discuss the petty crimes while international and national ones perpetuate. Makes a more sensational front page story in a Murdoch paper.Not that feral elite planned the riots. People get fr*gg*ng
angry, and anger is irrational. From the country that produced the (excellent IMHO) film, 28 Days. But like anger,
when it explodes, the person or group that is angry is marginalized because anger and outrage are marginalized emotions. They are infantilized, sedated (free booze/uncontrollable influx of street drugs), or locked down.A comic once said Bush senior was the great fisherman of men's souls. He fought for the right of every embryo to see birth, then cut back social services to sigle moms, families, education and health care, only to uphold the death penalty for adults. The comic said Bush sr. was like, save them now, throw back, kill em later.
I had better stop for the morning.
Posted by sigismund on August 10, 2011, at 13:54:14
In reply to Re: A feral elite » sigismund, posted by floatingbridge on August 10, 2011, at 10:12:26
This is pretty good.
Posted by floatingbridge on August 10, 2011, at 19:02:43
In reply to Re: A feral elite » floatingbridge, posted by sigismund on August 10, 2011, at 13:54:14
> This is pretty good.
>
> http://www.truth-out.org/panic-streets-london/1312999377I want to quote this because it is making me cry right now:
Riots are about power, and they are about catharsis. They are not about poor parenting, or youth services being cut, or any of the other snap explanations that media pundits have been trotting out: structural inequalities, as a friend of mine remarked today, are not solved by a few pool tables. People riot because it makes them feel powerful, even if only for a night. People riot because they have spent their whole lives being told that they are good for nothing, and they realise that together they can do anything literally, anything at all. People to whom respect has never been shown riot because they feel they have little reason to show respect themselves, and it spreads like fire on a warm summer night. And now people have lost their homes, and the country is tearing itself apart.
The author used the word viral at least three times.
Thank you for the link.
Posted by sigismund on August 12, 2011, at 19:14:18
In reply to Re: A feral elite » sigismund, posted by floatingbridge on August 10, 2011, at 19:02:43
Do you remember where one conservative party MP was using his parliamentary allowance to install a moat around his (what's the right word?) house.
That's rather endearing in its way.
The whole of the parliament, it seemed, was on the take.
Posted by floatingbridge on August 13, 2011, at 14:00:17
In reply to Re: A feral elite » floatingbridge, posted by sigismund on August 12, 2011, at 19:14:18
> Do you remember where one conservative party MP was using his parliamentary allowance to install a moat around his (what's the right word?) house.
:-)
Oh dear. No. Would their have been crocodiles, too?
>
> That's rather endearing in its way.
>
> The whole of the parliament, it seemed, was on the take.Another reason why I twitch at the word 'corporation'
http://www.truth-out.org/shiny-happy-corporate-people/1313243063
I am a sorry conversationalist at the moment. A little copy and paste now is about my limit. On my new slate device. You have one, too? The little book sized thing that has no wires (gee, I sound like my dad. We had a dial wall phone in our old house until about six years ago...).
Posted by sigismund on August 13, 2011, at 15:11:31
In reply to Re: A feral elite » sigismund, posted by floatingbridge on August 13, 2011, at 14:00:17
I don't like a lot of ozrock, but here are some songs from an 80's 90's band.
David McComb had a heart problem, then a heart transplant. Then he OD'd on heroin.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6y1nISLVq4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGP6fmpIxt0
I saw them once.
Posted by floatingbridge on August 13, 2011, at 19:25:44
In reply to Re: A feral elite, posted by sigismund on August 13, 2011, at 15:11:31
> I don't like a lot of ozrock, but here are some songs from an 80's 90's band.
>
> David McComb had a heart problem, then a heart transplant. Then he OD'd on heroin.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6y1nISLVq4
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGP6fmpIxt0>;
> I saw them once.For some reason the last link won't load. The first the long Infidelity was fabulous. I also surfed a bit and really liked fields (plains?) of Glaas and my baby thinks she's a train.
1985 places it rightvwhen I would have loved their live shows. Plus their name references a favorite StarTrek episode :-)
I might be able to get a copy of the first album. Sending the link to a friend too (a kitchen table recording artist with lovely quiet songs).
Did you know them?
I hope this isn't callous, but it crossed my mind, the old question, and a heroin overdose isn't the worst way to go, among the list of ways. Am I very mistaken? (I am not implying his overdose was intentional, nor anything else.)
This was a treat.
Posted by sigismund on August 13, 2011, at 19:37:19
In reply to Re: A feral elite » sigismund, posted by floatingbridge on August 13, 2011, at 19:25:44
>Am I very mistaken?
No, you are not mistaken.
Let me try a different way
Posted by floatingbridge on August 13, 2011, at 19:42:52
In reply to Re: A feral elite, posted by sigismund on August 13, 2011, at 15:11:31
If anything, see if you can locate the story Emergency. I have never read anything liike it. Actually, the entir chain of stories would take one long sitting.
I had the pleasure of seeing the author read. He read two full stories. A woman seated next to me had never heard
them/read them. She was giddy and harrowed like she had been at a carnival ride that left her white knuckled.I have never quite experienced such eloquent, painful, black comedy to date.
Oh, oh. I went on too long.
But this came out, hmmmm, maybe 1993? Guessing?
The movie is actually o.k. But the main character is Billy Cruddup, a hopelessly handsome, charismatic man. I like to think the the character known through the stories/novel known simply as F*ck Head had less natural charm. Not a bad movie though. Lots of cute VW bugs and crazy young people in old farmhouses.
Posted by floatingbridge on August 14, 2011, at 14:35:02
In reply to Re: A feral elite » floatingbridge, posted by sigismund on August 13, 2011, at 19:37:19
Have you heard of this?
Posted by floatingbridge on August 14, 2011, at 14:53:29
In reply to Re: A feral elite, posted by sigismund on August 13, 2011, at 15:11:31
http://www.npr.org/2011/08/12/139583924/the-lone-star-state-beginnings-of-rick-perry?ps=rs
Posted by sigismund on August 16, 2011, at 14:07:01
In reply to And someone else for me to worry about...., posted by floatingbridge on August 14, 2011, at 14:53:29
I imagine the US authorities have watched those riots with interest, paying attention to the tendency for the riot to edge closer to a race riot.
I don't know how many blacks are in US jails. A couple of million? It's not cheap keeping them there.
Not that one should ever expect humanity to learn anything. Humanity always redoubles its efforts instead.
Posted by floatingbridge on August 16, 2011, at 14:30:26
In reply to Re: And someone else for me to worry about...., posted by sigismund on August 16, 2011, at 14:07:01
> I imagine the US authorities have watched those riots with interest, paying attention to the tendency for the riot to edge closer to a race riot.
>
> I don't know how many blacks are in US jails. A couple of million? It's not cheap keeping them there.
>
> Not that one should ever expect humanity to learn anything.>Humanity always redoubles its efforts instead.
That's what my doc's always did. See the results.
Posted by floatingbridge on August 16, 2011, at 14:59:42
In reply to Re: And someone else for me to worry about...., posted by sigismund on August 16, 2011, at 14:07:01
Yes. Not folks on the street far as I can tell so much, certainly not much press. But certain people. Well there have been plans in place for all sorts of things. Even internment camps. Homeland security ramped up what was already in place.
Frankly, I don't know whose paranoid agenda it is. It's decades old. Pathological IMO.
Does your country have an equivalent to our homeland security? Jeez. Least it's not called the motherland security. National security seems like a perfectly serviceable term to me.
> I imagine the US authorities have watched those riots with interest, paying attention to the tendency for the riot to edge closer to a race riot.
>
> I don't know how many blacks are in US jails. A couple of million? It's not cheap keeping them there.
>
> Not that one should ever expect humanity to learn anything. Humanity always redoubles its efforts instead.
Posted by floatingbridge on August 16, 2011, at 15:08:04
In reply to And someone else for me to worry about...., posted by floatingbridge on August 14, 2011, at 14:53:29
> http://www.npr.org/2011/08/12/139583924/the-lone-star-state-beginnings-of-rick-perry?ps=rs
TRANSCRIPT
Thom Hartmann here on the news
You need to know this. Rick Perry is wasting no time resorting to violent rhetoric in his campaign for President. While speaking to a crowd in Iowa Perry weighed in on the Federal Reserve and Chairman Ben Bernankes monetary policy saying, If this guy prints more money between now and the election, I dunno what yall would do to him in Iowa but we would treat him pretty ugly down in Texas. Perry went on to say, Printing more money to play politics at this particular time in American history is almost treasonous in my
opinion. Of course people can be put to death if convicted of treason. So here we have a guy running for President who just hinted at dragging the Federal Reserve Chairman down
to Texas to be executed. Economist Nouriel Roubini tweeted about the comment saying, The Texan thug is making murder threats on the Fed Chairman. Looks like Rick Perry is really running for America's executioner-in-chief, and he's already there as the Governor who has killed more prisoners - at least one who was innocent - than any other Governor in history. Rick Perry apparently loves killing people as much as he loves threatening it.sigh.
And re: Murdoch:
The UK may have found the smoking gun in Rupert-gate. Former Murdoch reporter Clive Goodman wrote a letter back in 2007 that points to top executives having full knowledge of the phone hacking scandal and routinely talking about it in meetings with their staff. The letter names Andy Coulson who later took a job as Prime Minister David Camerons communications director as one of the executives with prior knowledge. They'll rob you with a sixgun or rob you with a pen, the old saying goes. Let's see if the white-collar criminals are held to the same account as blue-collars ones would be.
Posted by sigismund on August 16, 2011, at 17:28:28
In reply to Better this world » sigismund, posted by floatingbridge on August 14, 2011, at 14:35:02
>Have you heard of this?
No, I haven't.
Is it good?
Politics is so depressing. We have this abysmal level of debate here, and that being our worst thing, we should count ourselves lucky.
I wanted to give you a link to Natalie Merchant's 'Motheralnd' but I could not find the album version. I could find St Judas, which has the excellent Mavis Staples on it....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENJ5S2wN8Z0Here are the lyrics to Motherland. It is so sad. I love it.
Where in hell can you go
Far from the things that you know
Far from the sprawl of concrete
That keeps crawling its way
About 1,000 miles a day?Take one last look behind
Commit this to memory and mind
Don't miss this wasteland, this terrible place
When you leave
Keep your heart off your sleeveMotherland cradle me
Close my eyes
Lullaby me to sleep
Keep me safe
Lie with me
Stay beside me
Don't go, don't you goO, my five & dime queen
Tell me what have you seen?
The lust and the avarice
The bottomless, the cavernous greed
Is that what you see?Motherland cradle me
Close my eyes
Lullaby me to sleep
Keep me safe
Lie with me
Stay beside me
Don't goIt's your happiness I want most of all
And for that I'd do anything at all, o mercy me!
If you want the best of it or the most of all
If there's anything I can do at allNow come on shot gun bride
What makes me envy your life?
Faceless, nameless, innocent, blameless and free,
What's that like to be?Motherland cradle me
Close my eyes
Lullaby me to sleep
Keep me safe
Lie with me
Stay beside me
Don't go, don't you go
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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