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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 17 of 17. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Happyflower 1 :-) on August 29, 2007, at 21:18:52
or other? I didn't grow up with politics, so I don't have any teachings about it from a traditonal family values kind of thing.
I talk to people of all political parties but I am confused because it seems like all of them are biased torwards other parties, and think their's is the best. So how do I find out the basics so I can make up my mind. I am looking for unbiased info if it exhists for a good starting point.
Any ideas where to start?
Posted by caraher on August 30, 2007, at 11:54:57
In reply to How do you know if you are democrat or republican, posted by Happyflower 1 :-) on August 29, 2007, at 21:18:52
I truly believe very few Americans are really Democrats or Republicans simply because the "two-party system" is so artificial and limited relative to the full spectrum of political views. That's not to say people don't tend to identify more with one party or the other, and there's no shortage of, say, Republicans who really might be Libertarians except that they feel third party votes are wasted, or Democrats who would be happier as Greens.
The two major parties are marriages of convenience, and neither really has a consistent intellectual basis. There are tendencies, of course, but they tend to be most accurately described in terms of their dominant constituencies. So for instance, many Republicans will say their party opposes "big government" yet seem to acknowledge no limits to increasing the military and security apparatus of the federal government (and to the spending that goes along with that). Similarly, while Democrats position themselves as champions of the working class they offer no meaningful alternatives to increasing concentration of wealth and power in the hands of corporate interests.
Probably not very helpful... but I guess I just don't believe there's an "objective" way to figure out whether you're "really" a Democrat or Republican. I'd say you need to figure out what your principles are independently then make pragmatic choices based on who will deliver something closer to your wishes.
Posted by Happyflower 1 :-) on August 30, 2007, at 21:16:32
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are democrat or republi, posted by caraher on August 30, 2007, at 11:54:57
Hi Caraher,
Thanks for writing that, no wonder I am confused! I just don't seem to fit in anywhere, really. I just thought there was some "test" to take that would tell which way you swing. But I guess that would make it too easy! LOL
Maybe it is better just to remain ignorant, things are less complicated that way!
Posted by caraher on August 31, 2007, at 21:55:17
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are democrat or republi, posted by Happyflower 1 :-) on August 30, 2007, at 21:16:32
There was a pretty popular online test that I feel worked as a sort of recruiting tool for Libertarians. See http://www.politicalcompass.org/
I remember winding up way off in some corner a few years ago...
Posted by caraher on September 1, 2007, at 11:31:15
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are democrat or republi, posted by caraher on August 31, 2007, at 21:55:17
Here's where I wound up:
Economic Left/Right: -8.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.97
Posted by Sigismund on September 1, 2007, at 14:47:31
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are democrat or republi, posted by caraher on September 1, 2007, at 11:31:15
Economic Left/Right: -4.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.77This is perhaps the same corner you wound up in.
Margaret Thatcher and Hitler so close to each other in the opposite corner.....something to savour.
Posted by Happyflower 1 :-) on September 2, 2007, at 12:16:22
I think I am even more confused!
Econ left/right -1.88
Social lib/authoritarian 2.46So what does that make me?
Posted by gardenergirl on September 2, 2007, at 15:31:09
In reply to My corner » caraher, posted by Sigismund on September 1, 2007, at 14:47:31
Economic Left/Right: -5.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.31I seem to be more squarely in this corner than the last time I took this a couple of years ago. I like being in the same corner as the Dalai Lama, though. :)
gg
Posted by Sigismund on September 2, 2007, at 17:00:41
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are democrat or republi, posted by caraher on September 1, 2007, at 11:31:15
I'm the closest to Hitler and Thatcher then?
It must have been when I said it was sometimes OK to spank your kids, or that a people should stick to their own kind?
I must study that map.
Posted by Sigismund on September 2, 2007, at 17:02:33
In reply to Okay what do my figures mean?, posted by Happyflower 1 :-) on September 2, 2007, at 12:16:22
Does that mean you're in the opposite corner to Stalin?
Who's in there?
Is that the Milton Friedman corner?
Posted by Happyflower 1 :-) on September 2, 2007, at 18:17:09
In reply to Re: Okay what do my figures mean? » Happyflower 1 :-), posted by Sigismund on September 2, 2007, at 17:02:33
I have no idea, I am not even sure what the people mean, except Hitler. Maybe I should take the test again, so I can see. lol
Posted by caraher on September 3, 2007, at 17:42:39
In reply to Re: Okay what do my figures mean? » Happyflower 1 :-), posted by Sigismund on September 2, 2007, at 17:02:33
Actually, I think that puts her in the Stalin quadrant, but so close to the middle of the whole map that I'd say she's "centrist"
Posted by Happyflower 1 :-) on September 3, 2007, at 19:21:31
In reply to Re: Okay what do my figures mean?, posted by caraher on September 3, 2007, at 17:42:39
Please define what a centrist means, if that is me what you are talking about. But only if it means something good. lol
BUT,,, if it means I don't know which way I swing, well I know that already!
So if I ran for office, which party would I run for?
Posted by caraher on September 3, 2007, at 20:58:58
In reply to Re: Okay what do my figures mean? » caraher, posted by Happyflower 1 :-) on September 3, 2007, at 19:21:31
I just mean not at any of the extremes. Sure, that's a good thing :)
Compared to the folks in the primaries running for president rated by the site, you'd land among the Democrats. Looks like nearest either Dennis Kucinich or John Edwards
Posted by Happyflower 1 :-) on September 3, 2007, at 21:38:16
In reply to Re: Okay what do my figures mean?, posted by caraher on September 3, 2007, at 20:58:58
Thanks Caraher!
I think it is close to being right. I looked at the 2004 elections, and lets just say I didn't vote for Bush, sooooo I guess I would be a Moderate Democrate you think? or liberal Democrate? Dang! But thanks for your help.
Posted by caraher on September 4, 2007, at 10:11:54
In reply to Re: Okay what do my figures mean? » caraher, posted by Happyflower 1 :-) on September 3, 2007, at 21:38:16
That's the hard part about labels... in the US I guess you'd be considered a liberal Democrat, but our entire system is skewed to the right compared to most other western democracies. (Which is why every primary candidate listed, except two longshot candidates, is in the right half of the diagram.)
Posted by Sigismund on September 5, 2007, at 14:29:30
In reply to Re: Okay what do my figures mean?, posted by caraher on September 4, 2007, at 10:11:54
The thing I notice in reading statements from the candidates is the religion factor. I found Hilary Clinton and John Edwards very difficult to take and swallow on that. It might be a cultural style? McCain was easier to hack, as was (it pains me to say) Giulliani.
How much do ideas matter anyway? What I would like to see is some kind of indicator of ruthlessness vs decency.
This is the end of the thread.
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