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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by fayeroe on June 11, 2007, at 21:06:52
am i upset?
am i mad?
am i scared?
our entire family is just sick about it. we just lost my nephew, in January, and now Josh has to go back....damn this "surge" (urge)
Posted by caraher on June 12, 2007, at 12:45:35
In reply to Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year, posted by fayeroe on June 11, 2007, at 21:06:52
I'm sorry (((fayeroe)))
It's sickening how the burden of this enterprise falls disproportionately on so few people. It's time for everyone to come home to stay.
Posted by zenhussy on June 12, 2007, at 12:53:22
In reply to Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year, posted by fayeroe on June 11, 2007, at 21:06:52
Posted by Sigismund on June 12, 2007, at 18:19:45
In reply to Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year, posted by fayeroe on June 11, 2007, at 21:06:52
There was an interesting discusion I heard on Iraq. Gwynn Dyer, the Canadian military expert said that the decision to withdraw the troops would be made within hours of the US Presidential election (whoever won?) (allowing, presumably for the 40,000 permanently based there in the 5 new bases). Eliot Weinberger wondered about the Administration trying one last roll of the dice in Iran, but felt that the army would rather stage a coup than try that. Then, I thought, there is the possiblility of another terrorist attack and our politics being thrown even further out of whack. Alison Bronowski spoke persuasively about the peril that these policies have placed Australia (and by extension the US) in. And as you know Andrew Bacevich did not turn up because his son had been killed in Iraq. Incidentally his replacement mentioned a death figure that I had never heard asserted before, and which I assume cannot be right....something like 800,000 dead, something like 4,000,000 displaced. Hopefully the more moderate 400,000 is the the better estimate.
Not a lot of comfort, is it Pat?
Posted by Dinah on June 13, 2007, at 10:20:08
In reply to Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year, posted by fayeroe on June 11, 2007, at 21:06:52
My brother's been notified he'll be called up in the early fall, although he hasn't been told where. We're all quite anxious about it. He is at heart a gentle soul, and I think I'm more worried about what it's going to do to him or what he might be called upon to do even than I am about his physical safety.
He was in Afghanistan, but in the time period where the Afghan people were largely positive in feelings towards them.
Posted by caraher on June 13, 2007, at 18:22:45
In reply to Re: Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year » fayeroe, posted by Dinah on June 13, 2007, at 10:20:08
"I think I'm more worried about what it's going to do to him or what he might be called upon to do even than I am about his physical safety."
That's a very genuine thing to worry about. One dirty secret the military makes a point of not telling recruits is just how high the rate of psychiatric casualties is. Two factoids suffice to capture this. First, it is the most common type of casualty. Second, studies show that it is essentially inevitable among soldiers kept in combat continuously for long periods of time (i.e. more than say a month).
At this point, the US is rapidly dissipating its "boots on the ground" combat strength. The US can still bomb anyone back to the stone age and beyond, but forget about sustaining even the current military occupations, let alone expanding their scope. This is one reason why analysts figure the ill-advised war the ultra-hawks seek with Iran would be basically a bombing campaign - there really are no other options.
And that previous paragraph, grim as it is, leaves aside the human cost of empire as felt by the families of the few who do serve, let alone those in the occupied countries.
Posted by Sigismund on June 13, 2007, at 20:50:20
In reply to Re: Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year, posted by caraher on June 13, 2007, at 18:22:45
I assume the reason they haven't captured bin Laden is the security of the Pakistani nuclear material, now that letting off such a bomb on the American mainland is on the agenda.
Bombing Iran would create even more of a zone of insecurity, stretching between the Caspian, Arabian and the Mediterranean Seas.
Hopefully (by now) the optimists have lost confidence.
Posted by Sigismund on June 14, 2007, at 2:36:04
In reply to Re: Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year, posted by Sigismund on June 13, 2007, at 20:50:20
I've been wondering all afternoon about what I wote.
I remember a time when it was inconceivable that an aircraft should be hijacked.
Last night on the TV there was an ex-CIA agent talking very frankly about the (accepted) torture of an Australian citizen, Mamdou Habib, rendered to Egypt for the purpose.
He said something like
'If we want a good interrogation, we send them to Jordan. If we want them tortured, we send them to Syria. If we want them killed, we send them to Egypt. Of course the Australian government knew. We told them.'
Naturally the Australian government has repeatedly denied any and all knowlege over time.
Our leaders like to talk about what kind of message we are sending, and I wonder what results the behaviour of the Australian Government will have in the future.
There is no way I can characterise our government under the civility rules here.
All of this stuff is connected.
Posted by fayeroe on June 15, 2007, at 17:17:07
In reply to Re: Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year, posted by Sigismund on June 14, 2007, at 2:36:04
my son-in-law and daughter came down here last night for my photography show. he looks so thin and gaunt.
he has PTSD and is getting very little care for it. he did stuff during his first tour that has changed him forever. he was stationed in Kuwait and went into Iraq on "sorties" but now he will be IN Iraq all of the time. he's so gentle and kind. seems like such a youngster to me. he's ten years younger than my daughter, but he's not a kid now.
his daughter will know now that he's gone. she was too little during his first tour to really get it. she saw a battle on the news, before they got it switched, and she said, "that's war".......
i mentioned to someone today that i've become so jaded with local, state and federal government that whenever i hear something bad, i'm like "that figures"......this war was a mistake before it ever got off the ground.
i'm floored by what the man said about the torture and killing......ewwwwwwwww. makes chills run over me......as long as it isn't their family.......it's okay.
Posted by Sigismund on June 15, 2007, at 20:04:19
In reply to Re: Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year » Sigismund, posted by fayeroe on June 15, 2007, at 17:17:07
>i'm floored by what the man said about the torture and killing......ewwwwwwwww. makes chills run over me......as long as it isn't their family.......it's okay
I thought at least he was frank, and too, he was speaking out of a sense of considerable frustration that I didn't fully understand.
Michael Scheuer, the head of the unit to catch bin Laden was frank too.
Asked what he thought happened to those subject to rendition, he said "I don't care."
He's written a book "Through Our Enemies Eyes. Osama bin Laden, Radical Islam and the Future of America".
They both seemed like realism and honesty itself compared to our leaders, which seems like an appalling thing to say.
Then again they're not politicians and can ignore the media.
Is that it?But our government has connived in this, and for what purpose?
I'd say power and influence, but it won't look so good in the years to come.All the innocent people caught up in (as you said) 'something so lame'.
Posted by fayeroe on June 15, 2007, at 20:35:43
In reply to Re: Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year » fayeroe, posted by Sigismund on June 15, 2007, at 20:04:19
> >i'm floored by what the man said about the torture and killing......ewwwwwwwww. makes chills run over me......as long as it isn't their family.......it's okay
>
> I thought at least he was frank, and too, he was speaking out of a sense of considerable frustration that I didn't fully understand.
> Michael Scheuer, the head of the unit to catch bin Laden was frank too.
> Asked what he thought happened to those subject to rendition, he said "I don't care."
> He's written a book "Through Our Enemies Eyes. Osama bin Laden, Radical Islam and the Future of America".
> They both seemed like realism and honesty itself compared to our leaders, which seems like an appalling thing to say.
> Then again they're not politicians and can ignore the media.
> Is that it?
>
> But our government has connived in this, and for what purpose?
> I'd say power and influence, but it won't look so good in the years to come.
>
> All the innocent people caught up in (as you said) 'something so lame'.the frankness is what startled me..........i'm used to the secretive crap......can't see Cheney's visitor logs, etc. etc. etc. notice how Bush loved Albania......no fear of being killed. all of his audiences here are hand picked...........
Posted by Sigismund on June 15, 2007, at 21:41:46
In reply to Re: Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year, posted by fayeroe on June 15, 2007, at 20:35:43
Yes, cheered in Albania and Estonia.
(As long as they forget the idea that the rest of the world is eastern Europe.)
Posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on June 18, 2007, at 22:03:09
In reply to Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year, posted by fayeroe on June 11, 2007, at 21:06:52
> am i upset?
> am i mad?
> am i scared?
> our entire family is just sick about it. we just lost my nephew, in January, and now Josh has to go back....
>
> damn this "surge" (urge)Pat...I wish I could do some miracle. This is blood on Bush and Cheney's hands. I'd suggest your son-in-law hop it up here to Canada, but sadly Canadian Conservatives are not making it easy for those souls who wish not to participate in such a cruel, horrid, inhumane war. Maybe he could skip to...I dunno...Ireland?? I'd seriously consider it.
Peace,Love, and Hope.
Jay
Posted by fayeroe on June 18, 2007, at 22:33:04
In reply to Re: Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year » fayeroe, posted by Jay_Bravest_Face on June 18, 2007, at 22:03:09
Thank you, Jay. They are moving down here. Ft. Hood. Two hours away! So, at least I'll get to visit often and they can come down here.
The more I learn about this administration, the more afraid I am of where we're heading..........
I wish they could move to Canada, Mexico.....somewhere...........xoxoxo pat
Posted by karen_kay on June 19, 2007, at 12:59:08
In reply to Son-In-Law back to Iraq in December for year, posted by fayeroe on June 11, 2007, at 21:06:52
i'm sorry. it sucks. seems this whole damn world/war sucks right now.
don't know what i can say that's civil other than i'm thinking of you.
my neighbor was moving out (he jsut moved in not too long ago) and told me he's in the nat'l guard and was called to duty in january. he wasn't optimistic at all. the nat'l guard now too? i'd be running to mexico if it were me. does that make me a coward or brave? i'd say brave...
((((((pat)))))) my sister's exhusband is there. i talk to him when he calls, but i don't know what to say, you know? b/c he tells all. and i jsut want to say 'run for your life, what's wrong with you?' i guess i'm a chicken? or activist? or hippie? i haven't decided yet, but i'd be running as fast as i could, in the opposite direction.
my thoughts are with you darling. and him. and your family. and there's an election coming up. here's to that, eh? (is that civil?)
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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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