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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 15 of 15. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Bobby on November 8, 2005, at 21:11:13
a good example of immigration out of control----we're(USA) next.
Posted by AuntieMel on November 9, 2005, at 10:50:16
In reply to France is, posted by Bobby on November 8, 2005, at 21:11:13
I agree that controlling the borders is something to be addressed, but the people I've seen that move here are very hard working people, not expecting anything from the govt.
Magically whisk them all away and the US economy would probably be in the dumpster.
Posted by lil' jimi on November 9, 2005, at 13:26:43
In reply to France is, posted by Bobby on November 8, 2005, at 21:11:13
> a good example of immigration out of control----we're(USA) next.
a few hundred years too late!
it already happened, Bobby.that is what the Native Americans said about the white man's invasion.
think we should go back where we came from?
Posted by Bobby on November 9, 2005, at 14:28:56
In reply to Re: France is, posted by lil' jimi on November 9, 2005, at 13:26:43
Yes---I'm part Cherokee.
Posted by Bobby on November 9, 2005, at 22:01:30
In reply to Re:Are we? » Bobby, posted by AuntieMel on November 9, 2005, at 10:50:16
your right . Immigrants (MOST) are hard worker but many Do receive govt. assistance. And the first thing is to have as many babies as possible---seems like it --as least where I live. Alot don't bother trying to learn English and that enevitably hurt them. they are paid meager wages. the Aristocrats keep getting richer and the poor keep getting poorer--but I agree that they are so ingrained in our economy that a mass exit would break the economy. however, i think we should be more prudent on immigration. I can be a wonderful tool to some---my wife is an immigrant so I have mixed emotions.
Posted by jay on November 11, 2005, at 14:58:43
In reply to France is, posted by Bobby on November 8, 2005, at 21:11:13
Well..I think it has to be said first...Canada is the *most* multiculturally diverse per capita country in the world. (According to the U.N. Yearbook) Yet, we all get along great, and are very, very tolerant and really enjoy the cultural mosaic. People should be looking to the Canadian Model of Immigration. In fact, we just added another 100,000 immigrants for the year as part of our immigration quota. Canada is really pulling ahead as one, if not the, most peaceful, safest, tolerant countries in the world. On this Rememberance Day, this is part of what so many of our soldiers have died for. Peace...equality...good government...yeah that sounds good.
Jay
Posted by AuntieMel on November 11, 2005, at 16:34:14
In reply to Re: France is » Bobby, posted by jay on November 11, 2005, at 14:58:43
France is densly populated. The US and Canada have lots and lots of space.
I think when you cram a lot of poor people into a small area it helps feed itself. If you listen only to how bad things are you can't help but start to think there isn't another way.
Big city tenements in the US and the 'projects' do much the same.
Posted by Dr. Bob on November 12, 2005, at 2:15:29
In reply to Re:Are we? » AuntieMel, posted by Bobby on November 9, 2005, at 22:01:30
> Immigrants (MOST) are hard worker but many Do receive govt. assistance. And the first thing is to have as many babies as possible---seems like it --as least where I live. Alot don't bother trying to learn English
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Thanks,
Bob
Posted by Bobby on November 13, 2005, at 21:08:52
In reply to Re: please be civil » Bobby, posted by Dr. Bob on November 12, 2005, at 2:15:29
Sorry if i made a sweeping generalization--but I cringe every time I pick up the phone and hear,"to hear this message in English, press 1." Maybe my ancestors did the same--who knows. It's just frustrating and I apologize for any uncivilness.
Posted by Dr. Bob on November 15, 2005, at 2:04:55
In reply to Re: please be civil, posted by Bobby on November 13, 2005, at 21:08:52
Posted by Jakeman on November 18, 2005, at 21:19:07
In reply to France is, posted by Bobby on November 8, 2005, at 21:11:13
> a good example of immigration out of control----we're(USA) next.
I've wondered about this question somewhat. In terms of language, I speak English (I wish I knew other languages) In my family research I've found that most of my ancestors spoke Gaelic, a Scottish or Irish form. But we adapted to speak English because that was the language of our colonizers. In Ireland, they've fought against it, and now you see road signs that are both in English and Gaelic. I guess it begs the question of what is the true language of Americans. Yes English has become the standard that everyone wants to learn here and world-wide. In the US there other languages that come into play in this great melting pot we have. Some people still speak French in SW Louisiana, the language of their forebearers. I wonder what happened to the native American languages.
Anyway, something that I ponder....
warm regards, Jake
Posted by alexandra_k on November 19, 2005, at 0:50:19
In reply to Re: France is » Bobby, posted by Jakeman on November 18, 2005, at 21:19:07
> In terms of language, I speak English (I wish I knew other languages)
Yeah, me too. I tried learning some Maori in school but I really was very bad at it :-(
I think its amazing how people in Europe (and other parts of the world) can grow up learning a couple of languages. In fact... I do believe that most of the world knows two or three. Its actually a whole heap rarer to know just one.>In my family research I've found that most of my ancestors spoke Gaelic, a Scottish or Irish form. But we adapted to speak English because that was the language of our colonizers. In Ireland, they've fought against it, and now you see road signs that are both in English and Gaelic.
:-)
I think thats cool. They have some pretty looooong names over there, huh. We have a place called Ngarawahia. Not so long, but looks hard to pronounce. (Maori is actually fairly easy for an English speaker to pick up apparantly because the English speakers wrote it down and made it all nice and phonetic)>I guess it begs the question of what is the true language of Americans.
??
Is there any such thing?>Yes English has become the standard that everyone wants to learn here and world-wide.
I don't think the majority of people in the world would be happy to hear you say that! I don't think they would agree either. We may well think that they jolly well *should* learn English. We may well think that the world would be a more comprehensible place if they learned English. I really do believe, however, that the other people probably figure our ability to learn a language isn't so flash (most of us speaking only one) whereas if you know two or three already... may as well learn another ;-)
>In the US there other languages that come into play in this great melting pot we have. Some people still speak French in SW Louisiana, the language of their forebearers. I wonder what happened to the native American languages.
Probably all but died out.
I dunno. Are there any communities of native american indians around??? What do they speak?In New Zealand... We have two official languages: English and Maori. That being said... If you tried to take a check written in Maori to the bank... I imagine the teller wouldn't know what to do with it. At our university you can hand in assignments / tests where you have written your answer in Maori. You are supposed to give 3 weeks warning so they can attempt to find a specialist and / or translator (unless you are studying Maori, obviously).
For a while...
Maori kids were given the cane for speaking Maori at school (including in the playground).
They were told 'you will never get anywhere in life unless you stop that horrible vulgar language and learn English'. That generation grew up and... Did not teach their children Maori. Because they came to believe what their teachers and the greater society was telling them.The language was almost run into extinction.
The government put a lot of money into trying to teach people Maori again... In reperation. Scholarships for people to learn it and become teachers etc etc. TV adds. TV shows (the ones kids watch after school) trying to be a little more bi-lingual. Now... More and more Maori words are becoming mainstream.
There are bi-lingual schools now. Where half the teaching time is in English, and half is in Maori. There are also total submersion schools where from entry to school to intermediate (around age 11) the kids only speak Maori.
Despite what you might be inclined to think...
The bi-lingual kids tend to outperform comperable kids in totally English speaking schools. They also have more pride in their heritage and have more contact and involvement in their culture. The kids in the total submersion... Pick up English 'unofficially' anyway from watching TV and talking to people in the greater society (going to the shops etc). They tend to outperform kids who were only taught in English in school cert. english exams after 3 years of high school.But I probably should say...
That the bi-lingual / total submersion schools have a distinctively different flavour. More of a community. Probably... Wealthier families. And I'm pretty darned sure... More teachers / facilitators per kid than your average public school.
Posted by gromit on November 20, 2005, at 12:51:25
In reply to Re: France is, posted by lil' jimi on November 9, 2005, at 13:26:43
> that is what the Native Americans said about the white man's invasion.
Yeah, oh great boat people...
Posted by Jakeman on November 21, 2005, at 20:16:57
In reply to Re: France is » Jakeman, posted by alexandra_k on November 19, 2005, at 0:50:19
Alexandra,
I think that's great that you have worked on learning Maori. Some day I hope to visit your country. A New Zealander professor of mine always referred to it as "god's country."
>Yes English has become the standard that everyone wants to learn here and world-wide.
>
> I don't think the majority of people in the world would be happy to hear you say that!I was referring to the fact that English has become the language of business in the world. Several friends of mine have, or are currently, teaching English in various countries in Asia. My prediction is that eventually Chinese will become the dominant language for international communication.
Someone may correct me, but I think the Native American languages have almost died out. But there is an effort to keep them alive, especially on the Indian lands.
Spanish is the second most spoken language in the US, especially in the Southwest where I live. I have friends whose grandparents spoke Spanish as as their primary language, but now the grandchildren are taking Spanish lessons to relearn it. The "original" langugage here was from Apache, Commanche and other tribes. Like English here, Spanish is also a language of the conquerors. I guess times change, people adapt, as always, survival is upmost. At the same time we want some connection to our heritage.
warm regards, Jake
Posted by lil' jimi on November 26, 2005, at 2:24:47
In reply to Re: please be civil, posted by Bobby on November 13, 2005, at 21:08:52
hey, bobby,
you write:
> Sorry if i made a sweeping generalization--but I cringe every time I pick up the phone and hear,"to hear this message in English, press 1." Maybe my ancestors did the same--who knows. It's just frustrating and I apologize for any uncivilness.
>call me old fashioned, but i still go for the Mother of Exiles motif ...
"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"for me, it is still not that hokey ...
... even if i have to "Press One for English" ...i mean, here,
in The Land Of Immigrants,
are we not bound to revel in some of degree multicultural pluralism,
no matter how assimilated we all become?and is the United States not a greater and stronger nation for the diversity of her cultural and ethnic roots?
i mean, even if it might seem inconvenient some times ... ...
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