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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 34. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by crazy teresa on November 13, 2005, at 19:27:20
I'm not saying I agree with all of it, but it is pretty funny! ;~}
We The People of these United States
The following has been attributed to State Representative Mitchell Aye from GA. This guy should run for President one day..."We the sensible people of the United States, in an attempt to help everyone get along, restore some semblance of justice, avoid more riots, keep our nation safe, promote positive behavior, and secure the blessings of debt free liberty to ourselves and our great-great-great-grandchildren, hereby try one more time to ordain and establi sh some common sense guidelines for the terminally whiny, guilt ridden, delusional, and other liberal bed-wetters. We hold these truths to be self evident: that a whole lot of people are confused by the Bill of Rights and are so dim they require a Bill of NON-Rights."
ARTICLE I: You do not have the right to a new car, big screen TV, or any other form of wealth. More power to you if you can legally acquire them, but no one is guaranteeing anything.
ARTICLE II: You do not have the right to never be offended. This country is based on freedom, and that means freedom for everyone -- not just you! You may leave the room, turn the channel, express a different opinion, etc.; but the world is full of idiots, and probably always will be.
ARTICLE III: You do not have the right to be free from harm. If you stick a screwdriver in your eye, learn to be more careful, do not expect the tool manufacturer to make you and all your relatives independently wealthy.
ARTICLE IV: You do not have the right to free food and housing. Americans are the most charitable people to be found and will gladly help anyone in need, but we are quickly growing weary of subsidizing generation after generation of professional couch potatoes who achieve nothing more than the creation of another generation of professional couch potatoes.
ARTICLE V: You do not have the right to free health care. That would be nice, but from the looks of public housing, we're just not interested in public health care.
ARTICLE VI: You do not have the right to physically harm other people. If you kidnap, rape, intentionally maim, or kill someone, don't be surprised if the rest of us want to see you fry in the electric chair.
ARTICLE VII: You do not have the right to the possessions of others. If you rob, cheat, or coerce away the goods or services of other citizens, don't be surprised if the rest of us get together and lock you away in a place where you still won't have the right to a big screen color TV or a life of leisure.
ARTICLE VIII: You do not have the right to a job. All of us sure want you to have a job, and will gladly help you along in hard times, but we expect you to take advantage of the opportunities of education and vocational training laid before you to make yourself useful.
ARTICLE IX: You do not have the right to happiness. Being an American means that you have the right to PURSUE happiness which, by the way, is a lot easier if you are unencumbered by an over abundance of idiotic laws created by those of you who were confused by the Bill of Rights.
ARTICLE X: This is an English speaking country. We don't care where you are from, English is our language. Learn it or go back to wherever you came from!
(lastly....)
ARTICLE XI: You do not have the right to change our country's history or heritage. This country was founded on the belief in one true God. And yet, you are given the freedom to believe in any religion, any faith, or no faith at all; with no fear of persecution. The phrase IN GOD WE TRUST is part of our heritage and history and if you are uncomfortable with it, TOUGH!!!!
Posted by alexandra_k on November 14, 2005, at 14:54:29
In reply to US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd), posted by crazy teresa on November 13, 2005, at 19:27:20
> I'm not saying I agree with all of it, but it is pretty funny! ;~}
well... i suppose its good that you got a laugh out of it but i will say that i felt a little offended in response to some of it...
> terminally whiny, guilt ridden, delusional, and other liberal bed-wetters.
sorry, but i don't think thats very nice.
> ARTICLE I: You do not have the right to a new car, big screen TV, or any other form of wealth. More power to you if you can legally acquire them, but no one is guaranteeing anything.
lol. you mean more power to you if the government chooses to grant you exclusive ownership over them, and decides to create laws to enforce the ownership they have granted.
> ARTICLE II: You do not have the right to never be offended. This country is based on freedom, and that means freedom for everyone -- not just you! You may leave the room, turn the channel, express a different opinion, etc.; but the world is full of idiots, and probably always will be.freedom for everyone except suspected terrorists and those who have been incarcerated for acting in protest of the above mentioned law...
> ARTICLE III: You do not have the right to be free from harm. If you stick a screwdriver in your eye, learn to be more careful, do not expect the tool manufacturer to make you and all your relatives independently wealthy.
but where else but america could one expect this? perhaps it isn't right to 'expect' it, but it is surely more of a legitimate possibility in america than most other places in the world...
> ARTICLE IV: You do not have the right to free food and housing. Americans are the most charitable people to be found and will gladly help anyone in need,'most charitable'? stats please... 'gladly help anyone in need'? stats please... so... assisting people in need is considered to be a private, discretionary matter... up to the individual. a super-ogatory act that is morally praiseworthy when you do it, but is in no way something you *should* do (to the point where 'charity' is centralised and considered part of the function of government)
>we are quickly growing weary of subsidizing generation after generation of professional couch potatoes who achieve nothing more than the creation of another generation of professional couch potatoes.
hmm. now that thought doesn't seem very charitable to me...
> ARTICLE V: You do not have the right to free health care. That would be nice, but from the looks of public housing, we're just not interested in public health care.
do you mean that the government doesn't even prioritise housing so of course they aren't going to be prioritising health care?> ARTICLE VI: You do not have the right to physically harm other people. If you kidnap, rape, intentionally maim, or kill someone, don't be surprised if the rest of us want to see you fry in the electric chair.
aw. but they were a terrorist, surely ;-)
> ARTICLE VII: You do not have the right to the possessions of others. If you rob, cheat, or coerce away the goods or services of other citizens, don't be surprised if the rest of us get together and lock you away in a place where you still won't have the right to a big screen color TV or a life of leisure.hmm. dealt with that already i think...
> ARTICLE VIII: You do not have the right to a job.
oh. no right to a job. no right to possessions without a job. no right to life without the possessions that you get from a job...
>All of us sure want you to have a job,
or will condemn you as a 'couch potato' if you do not...
>and will gladly help you along in hard times,
though not so gladly after considering you to be a 'couch potato'...
> but we expect you to take advantage of the opportunities of education and vocational training laid before you to make yourself useful.
opportunities 'laid before you?????'
people who don't have an education and vocational training aren't useful? (that is implied).
> ARTICLE IX: You do not have the right to happiness. Being an American means that you have the right to PURSUE happiness which, by the way, is a lot easier if you are unencumbered by an over abundance of idiotic laws created by those of you who were confused by the Bill of Rights.'idiotic laws'?
> ARTICLE X: This is an English speaking country. We don't care where you are from, English is our language. Learn it or go back to wherever you came from!i don't think the american imigrants had that attitude when they discovered the already established american indians. how many imigrants bothered to learn their language?
> (lastly....)
> ARTICLE XI: You do not have the right to change our country's history or heritage.i think you will find... it is impossible to change the past. not much sense in granting someone the right to flap their arms and fly like a bird when it is impossible for them to do this...
>This country was founded on the belief in one true God.
dare i say... bit of a pain in the *ss that that turned out to be false then...
>And yet, you are given the freedom to believe in any religion, any faith, or no faith at all;
the implication being: even though you are wrong?
>with no fear of persecution.
unless we proclaim your god to be the god of a 'mass militant terrorist organisation'...
> The phrase IN GOD WE TRUST is part of our heritage and history and if you are uncomfortable with it, TOUGH!!!!
rape and torture and genocide is part of the heritage and history of the human race. i don't think saying 'TOUGH!!!' is much of a comeback for those who say that we can do better than how we used to do...
Posted by crazy teresa on November 14, 2005, at 17:39:31
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd) » crazy teresa, posted by alexandra_k on November 14, 2005, at 14:54:29
>well... i suppose its good that you got a laugh out of it but i will say that i felt a little offended in response to some of it...
And I find nearly every one of your comments offensive.
Posted by alexandra_k on November 14, 2005, at 18:00:52
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd) » alexandra_k, posted by crazy teresa on November 14, 2005, at 17:39:31
in my last post, or in general?
Posted by alexandra_k on November 14, 2005, at 18:07:09
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd) » alexandra_k, posted by crazy teresa on November 14, 2005, at 17:39:31
i probably shouldn't have gone through and answered all those points...
it is just that with something like that...
it is just so jolly tempting to do that if one does disagree.
and it is so jolly easy to pick...
because what i find hardest to take...
the thing that i really do have to say i find the hardest to take...
is the 'couch potato' thing.i had failed to appreciate...
just how many people do believe...
or how many people think it is perfectly acceptable to express...
comments to the effect that people are poor because they are lazy.now at this point i'm probably over-reacting...
but everytime you think 'poor' in a sentance...
try replacing the word 'poor' for the name 'alexandra_k'
and if that doesn't do it for you...
how about engaging in a little imaginitive exercise... just to humour me... how about imagining that for some totally bizzare reason you lose everything you have and try replacing the word 'poor' with your name.see how that feels.
still laughing?
Posted by alexandra_k on November 14, 2005, at 20:42:56
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd) » alexandra_k, posted by crazy teresa on November 14, 2005, at 17:39:31
i over-reacted majorly.
Posted by Dr. Bob on November 15, 2005, at 2:16:20
In reply to US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd), posted by crazy teresa on November 13, 2005, at 19:27:20
> the terminally whiny, guilt ridden, delusional, and other liberal bed-wetters.
Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel accused or put down. Even if you're quoting someone else.
I'm going to block you from posting for 3 weeks again.
If you or others have questions about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Follow-ups regarding these issues should be redirected to Psycho-Babble Administration. They, as well as replies to the above post, should of course themselves be civil.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by alexandra_k on November 15, 2005, at 19:29:39
In reply to US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd), posted by crazy teresa on November 13, 2005, at 19:27:20
very tentative...
very tentative...(((crazyt)))
you will be missed.
i'm sorry.
take care.
Posted by Bobby on November 15, 2005, at 20:38:38
In reply to US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd), posted by crazy teresa on November 13, 2005, at 19:27:20
about your ban. On a lighter note, I wonder--do your kids call you mother teresa? :) Take care!
Posted by wildcard on November 16, 2005, at 14:45:00
In reply to US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd), posted by crazy teresa on November 13, 2005, at 19:27:20
Was that the one I sent you?! As a US citizen, in my opinion, I believe most of it to be true and I for the *most* part agreed w/ it. I am glad that you had the courage to state *your* opinion although many won't and don't have to agree.
Posted by AuntieMel on November 17, 2005, at 13:17:03
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd) » crazy teresa, posted by alexandra_k on November 14, 2005, at 18:07:09
"because what i find hardest to take...
the thing that i really do have to say i find the hardest to take...
is the 'couch potato' thing.i had failed to appreciate...
just how many people do believe...
or how many people think it is perfectly acceptable to express...
comments to the effect that people are poor because they are lazy.now at this point i'm probably over-reacting...
but everytime you think 'poor' in a sentance...
try replacing the word 'poor' for the name 'alexandra_k'
and if that doesn't do it for you...
how about engaging in a little imaginitive exercise... just to humour me... how about imagining that for some totally bizzare reason you lose everything you have and try replacing the word 'poor' with your name."---------------------
Alex - I was poor once myself. When I first went to college I qualified for every government help out there - grants, loans, work-study - you name it I could get it.
So, I don't think all people are poor because they are lazy. And I believe there should (and there are) programs for those without resources to 'equalize.'
You are in school, so you don't even come close to being a couch potato.
But - humans being what they are, not all the same, I do believe that there *are* people who would happily not work as long as they can get around it. And it's those people who I don't believe my hard work should support.
But, all that aside, CT posted something she thought was funny and light hearted. I thought bits of it were pretty funny myself.
I think sometimes things should just be left at face value.
Posted by wildcard on November 17, 2005, at 16:51:28
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd) » alexandra_k, posted by AuntieMel on November 17, 2005, at 13:17:03
Posted by alexandra_k on November 17, 2005, at 17:58:55
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd) » alexandra_k, posted by AuntieMel on November 17, 2005, at 13:17:03
> But - humans being what they are, not all the same, I do believe that there *are* people who would happily not work as long as they can get around it. And it's those people who I don't believe my hard work should support.
I agree. Some people would happily stay at home and look after their children. Some people would happily spend their time working for charities rather than companies. Some people... Don't believe they can do anything worthwhile.
But I think all of these people deserve their basic needs met. And the latter... Need a little help figuring out what they might be able to do that they would no doubt find a whole heap more satisfying than sitting at home watching the box (which tends to be something that people revert to when they are suffering from depression, for example).
> But, all that aside, CT posted something she thought was funny and light hearted. I thought bits of it were pretty funny myself.
> I think sometimes things should just be left at face value.I did over-react.
But...
I also have a tendancy to over-react to jokes about
black people
blonde people
r*dneck people
etc
etc
i guess that because of the very real discrimination that is out there... people are sensitised to that... and tend to perceive 'more of the same' even when that is not intended.but that being said...
i over-reacted, yup.
and i am sorry that crazyt got blocked :-(
Posted by alexandra_k on November 17, 2005, at 22:27:35
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd) » alexandra_k, posted by AuntieMel on November 17, 2005, at 13:17:03
>And I believe there should (and there are) programs for those without resources to 'equalize.'
though... there are still differences in native ability...
> And it's those people who I don't believe my hard work should support.Ah. I should also say that...
Its not about your hard work supporting them...
Its about those people in the top few...
Who have so very very very much more than they need.
And most of them have not worked harder than you.
Most of them have not worked harder than...
Someone struggling to make ends meet
Working long hours
On minimum wage.There are people who work really very hard and they still don't have enough to make ends meet.
I think...
That there are people (in that top few) who could stand to have a lot less money (wouldn't make a practical difference to their lives) and that could be used to... Increase the minimum wage. Etc.
Because sometimes... Its about the hardworking people on the minimum wage... Who are making the *luxury* items... They are making the items that makes the owners of the company rich... And so there... Its the poor peoples hard work that is making the companies owners into billionaires...
And I imagine...
Its gotta hurt a little...
The notion that those hard working people on minimum wage...
Could save 5-10% and be millionaires...
When they can't make ends meet
And they are working their *sses off
And in light of that...
I can understand why people might just *give up*
And maybe even... Resign themselves to starving...
Or turning to crime...
When what I'm thinking...
Is it is more of a crime...
The minimum wage being what it is...
And the point that people get rich
Off other peoples hard work.And everybody in the world could have their basic needs met if only we redistributed the wealth a little more than we are at present...
And everybody could have *more* than their basic needs met in virtue of working hard (or being lucky I suppose)
But I think the situation as it is right now isn't so good :-(
And it isn't so good when food is exported for $$$
When people are starving
Because... Food is considered something that people produce to make money
And I think...
Food should be something that people produce to feed people.
And if we thought that way...
There wouldn't be any starving people.And no matter how *lazy* a person is
(though I don't think anybody is *just* lazy its more about depression and despair)
But even if there really were people out there who were just *lazy* of their own free willI still believe they should have their basic needs met.
And I believe that what they really need...
Is a little help to figure out something to do that they will find worthwhile.
But...
Given the minimum wage being what it is...
Given the working conditions for unskilled workers...
Given the point that many people are repeatedly told they are *stupid* and they *can't* read or learn or whatever...I can understand why there may well be some pepole out there who have...
Given up.
:-(
I think we should do something...
Posted by Gabbix2 on November 18, 2005, at 2:28:25
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd), posted by alexandra_k on November 17, 2005, at 22:27:35
I recieved a similar e-mail though it was supposedly from Australia, and It said Motto is "In God we Trust" if you don't like it.. leave. I thought that was amusing, because that *isn't* the Australian Motto.
That aside, I did not find the e-mail posted here humorous, but that's not really important, but the last line infuriated me, those kind of comments do actually trigger me. UMMM HELLO? The U.S was taken brutally from the Natives, and Mr. Aye *Dares* to talk about the
non-english changing history or heritage or religion?
Anyway, though I'm barely here at all anymore, I had to post and say I appreciate very much what you've said about that, and about poverty, and about Welfare. You lived on 80.00 a month, I lived on 70. Now that I'm on Disability I have 140.00 for everything except rent.
I needed to pop my head in and say that, because
I guess I'm so used to being with people in my own head space, I'm sometimes shocked that these views are still so common.
Posted by wildcard on November 18, 2005, at 9:07:12
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd), posted by alexandra_k on November 17, 2005, at 22:27:35
I agree that there are many excellent points brought out in this thread, many that I agree wholeheartedly with and some that I don't. These are issues that affect individuals each day and unless an individual has 'walked in those shoes' per say, it is often hard for them on a personal level to understand. IMO, I agree that things are definitely unequal, however I did take the above mentioned email lightly. I guess the difference w/ myself personally is that I read an opinion of another person and I have always respected that 'freedom'. I have realized that I may never 100% agree with something another person says, and I know that sometimes there are those certain things that hit that one raw nerve and as humans, we react. I know that CT did not mean to offend anyone though and even stated that she didn't agree w/ all he said. This is just one of those times where I wish there was a reverse button on life.
Posted by Gabbix2 on November 18, 2005, at 14:12:27
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd), posted by wildcard on November 18, 2005, at 9:07:12
>I did take the above mentioned email lightly. I guess the difference w/ myself personally is that I read an opinion of another person and I have always respected that 'freedom'. I have realized that I may never 100% agree with something another person says, and I know that sometimes there are those certain things that hit that one raw nerve and as humans, we react.
That's it, exactly : )
Nicely said.I'm sure there are things I laugh at that other people think are awful. I wouldn't post them on Babble though :0
I do have a genuine trigger response (though i'm not quite sure what that means to everyone) in this case it means I can't sleep.
And I don't look to be offended. However When I hear comments like "One true God" and "English is our language" It makes my blood boil.
I just can't help but think about the methods that were used on the Native people in order to make North America "Christian" and English Speaking. Entire cultures were destroyed, thousands died.
I can't take that lightly, just as I can't take the Jewish holocaust lightly.I wonder how anyone can speak so sanctimoniously, as if this the way North America has always been, and those historical atrocities forgotten. It really wasn't that long ago. And the irony is, the first white settlers were welcomed, they were fed by the Native people.
The last residential school for First Nations children who were without choice, taken from their homes in order to force them to break any connection their own culture was only closed in the 1970's
Additionally, I have a personal love of diversity. I live in a community with a high percentage of Punjabi speaking people, and I want to learn to speak Punjabi (Even though the store owners who try to teach me, chuckle good naturedly at my feeble pronounciation)**** I know that CT did not mean to offend anyone though and even stated that she didn't agree w/ all he said.
I realize that. And though I'm not saying Theresa will change her views,this is where I think open polite dialogue is very helpful.
I have said things that in retrospect I cringe about, because people offered me a different view, and I think differently now.
***This is just one of those times where I wish there was a reverse button on life.Yeah, wouldn't that be great.. for so many reasons :)
Oh and if anyone wonders how I can afford a computer on 140 a month, it's because I don't have a phone, I had to choose between the two.
Posted by wildcard on November 19, 2005, at 16:48:00
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd) » wildcard, posted by Gabbix2 on November 18, 2005, at 14:12:27
>I just can't help but think about the methods that were used on the Native people in order to make North America "Christian" and English Speaking. Entire cultures were destroyed, thousands died.
I can't take that lightly, just as I can't take the Jewish holocaust lightly.>I wonder how anyone can speak so sanctimoniously, as if this the way North America has always been, and those historical atrocities forgotten. It really wasn't that long ago. And the irony is, the first white settlers were welcomed, they were fed by the Native people.
Excellent point~ I am choking on my foot as I write this, and I should!
Posted by Gabbix2 on November 20, 2005, at 13:16:08
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd) » Gabbix2, posted by wildcard on November 19, 2005, at 16:48:00
I don't say these things to be argumentative, I have appreciated it when people have offered different views with me.
I remember once using the term "that's an old wives tale"
My friend said to me, "I really don't like that term, you know, those "old wives" had a lot of wisdom that we're only just acknowledging now"
Like holistic medicine, the value of certain herbs..
Don't get me wrong, I don't freak out if someone says that, and neither did she, no one says it to be insulting, I don't think anyone is really thinking of the "old wives" when they even say it. I'm still glad she mentioned it because it made me re-think a lot of things that I just say, or laugh at, without thinking of the history or true meaning behind them.
Posted by Gabbix2 on November 30, 2005, at 16:18:29
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights (an email I rec'd) » Gabbix2, posted by wildcard on November 19, 2005, at 16:48:00
ARTICLE X: This is an English speaking country. >We don't care where you are from, English is our language. Learn it or go back to wherever you came from!
(lastly....)
>This country was founded on the belief in one true God.When people say things like that.. and I hear it a lot. I have to give my head a shake.
One True GOD .. that would be Christianity right?
Christ.. Jesus
Uhhh Jesus was from the Middle East..If he came here, he'd be an Immigrant and he wouldn't be speaking English
Posted by Declan on December 1, 2005, at 11:40:48
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights-- One More Thing, posted by Gabbix2 on November 30, 2005, at 16:18:29
Gabbi, Maybe he was from the Middle East, but it doesn't sound right. What would Jesus do? I think he'd be a great football player, and dare I say it, a believer in the free market. Maybe he came over with the lost tribes of Israel, he could do the time thing as well, couldn't he?
Declan
Posted by lil' jimi on December 2, 2005, at 23:46:28
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights-- One More Thing, posted by Gabbix2 on November 30, 2005, at 16:18:29
>> ARTICLE X: This is an English speaking country.
>> We don't care where you are from, English is our language. Learn it or go back to wherever you came from!
>>In the immortal words of biblical scholar and Gov. Ma Ferguson, "If English was good enough for Jesus, it's good enough for Texas."
http://www.austinchronicle.com/issues/dispatch/2002-06-14/pols_capitol.html
Posted by Gabbix2 on December 3, 2005, at 0:25:46
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights-- One More Thang, posted by lil' jimi on December 2, 2005, at 23:46:28
Why hello Jimi
No kidding? He was not joking?
Really?Okay I'll look at the link
Posted by lil' jimi on December 3, 2005, at 8:52:45
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights-- One More Thang » lil' jimi, posted by Gabbix2 on December 3, 2005, at 0:25:46
and well hello to you too, my Miss Gabbi ...
i believe that to some extent it may be apocryphal,
but i wouldn't put it past the 1924 female governor of Texas.
Posted by Gabbix2 on December 3, 2005, at 14:01:05
In reply to Re: US Bill of Non-Rights-- One More Thang » Gabbix2, posted by lil' jimi on December 3, 2005, at 8:52:45
> i believe that to some extent it may be apocryphal,
> but i wouldn't put it past the 1924 female governor of Texas.Yeah, it's kind of scary how you can't quite know (even while you're saying hopefully "That can't be right")
It sounds frighteningly like a Quayle-ism.
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