![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 32. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by fayeroe on March 27, 2003, at 7:11:10
Dr. Bob: I've been reading and posting on here for a short while. And I've read alot more than I've posted. I am weighing in with an opinion about how you run your research project. First, your treatment of me: I did not understand the dynamics of how much Lou posted and how long he had been on here...I also didn't know how much acrimony existed between some of the posters. I posted a short sentence that it seemed things were getting "anal"...this also involved Pax. You came back and told us to be civil. I apologized to Lou. Other people receive "thank yous" when they apologize. I received nada. From you. But Lou was gracious and accepted it. I, personally, didn't think what I said was that big of a deal and after reading many more posts yesterday....it wasn't. Yesterday on "social" there was a huge chunk of time taken by someone who is obviously really needing help and you didn't intervene. Therefore, it looks like you pick and choose where, and with whom, you are going to contribute.
I see where you block people for over half a year. Being a psych doctor, and running this project essentially for your benefit, I would think that you would, more than anyone, know that the people are here BECAUSE they have problems in the first place. "Everyone stars in their own movie".....you produce, direct and star. In the short time I've been on here because I am depressed and having really tough times right now, I've become very disappointed and disenchanted with your project. I agree with so many of the posts protesting the way you handle this. But my solution is not to try to change you, my solution is to tell you how I feel about it and then exit. And I know that people can help each other over the internet. But I think you're a too heavy-handed and controlling in trying to impose your beliefs and values upon people who are here because they need a place to feel a part of a "like" community.I close by saying that it is awfully early and I may have rambled but I believe the essence of how I feel about this is clear. I'm sorry that I don't feel more positive about staying. For those with whom I've interacted and you've responded to me, thanks. I meant what I said to you. Good luck to all! Pat
Posted by Dinah on March 27, 2003, at 7:55:38
In reply to controlling/moderation of this site, posted by fayeroe on March 27, 2003, at 7:11:10
There was no inequality in moderating. He just wasn't here. I have every faith that he will see to everything when he gets here, which is why I mainly stayed out of everything.
I have to admit to having a feeling of safety when I know he's about.
Posted by Lou Pilder on March 27, 2003, at 9:12:09
In reply to controlling/moderation of this site, posted by fayeroe on March 27, 2003, at 7:11:10
fayeroe,
You wrote,
{I did not understand the dynamics of how much Lou posted and how long he had been on here...}
Could you clarify what the relevance could be as to [how long I have been a participant here?] and how that is involved in your post here? If you could, then I could have a better understanding of your post.
Thanks,
Lou
Posted by beardedlady on March 27, 2003, at 9:18:57
In reply to controlling/moderation of this site, posted by fayeroe on March 27, 2003, at 7:11:10
Hi, Pat:
I agree with everything you said, and I understand why you have to leave. I'm not going to talk you into staying because I wish that people could have the strength to go when they believe they should. Our stay often outlives the benefit of staying.
Thanks for your contribution here in that short time. And thanks for bringing Roe's victory to the forefront. And keep up the good work.
beardy : )>
Posted by stjames on March 27, 2003, at 11:37:09
In reply to controlling/moderation of this site, posted by fayeroe on March 27, 2003, at 7:11:10
>
> I see where you block people for over half a year.I agree with what you said, except this. The only
person I know that was blocked this long was because that again and again could not follow the rules. At some point my right to feel safe here overrides someone elses right to be hateful, again and again.
Posted by fayeroe on March 27, 2003, at 12:38:06
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site, posted by stjames on March 27, 2003, at 11:37:09
> >
> > I see where you block people for over half a year.
>
> I agree with what you said, except this. The only
> person I know that was blocked this long was because that again and again could not follow the rules. At some point my right to feel safe here overrides someone elses right to be hateful, again and again.i can understand that...pat
Posted by mair on March 27, 2003, at 15:42:04
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site, posted by fayeroe on March 27, 2003, at 12:38:06
I can understand why you might want to leave but I will be sorry to see you go. I know I have not been particularly active in awhile, but I think you've been a positive addition.
Mair
Posted by fayeroe on March 27, 2003, at 16:45:01
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » fayeroe , posted by mair on March 27, 2003, at 15:42:04
thank you. i appreciate your interaction also. pat
Posted by Dr. Bob on March 28, 2003, at 9:25:32
In reply to controlling/moderation of this site, posted by fayeroe on March 27, 2003, at 7:11:10
> I posted a short sentence that it seemed things were getting "anal"...this also involved Pax. You came back and told us to be civil. I apologized to Lou. Other people receive "thank yous" when they apologize. I received nada. From you. But Lou was gracious and accepted it.
Sorry about leaving you out. Was your post in that thread, too? I'm still not caught up yet...
> Yesterday on "social" there was a huge chunk of time taken by someone who is obviously really needing help and you didn't intervene.
OK, I'll check there next, but it may not be until later...
> I would think that you would, more than anyone, know that the people are here BECAUSE they have problems in the first place. "Everyone stars in their own movie".....you produce, direct and star. In the short time I've been on here because I am depressed and having really tough times right now, I've become very disappointed and disenchanted with your project... I know that people can help each other over the internet. But I think you're a too heavy-handed and controlling in trying to impose your beliefs and values upon people who are here because they need a place to feel a part of a "like" community.
I'm sorry you've been disappointed with this project, but thanks for your input. I guess I do produce, but it's awfully hard to direct anyone here, and you posters are the stars, not me.
Bob
Posted by bozeman on March 29, 2003, at 14:18:40
In reply to controlling/moderation of this site, posted by fayeroe on March 27, 2003, at 7:11:10
Pat
I am sorry that you are (apparently) feeling so disappointed and frustrated with the situation, and I certainly understand where you're coming from. Soon I intend to query Dr. Bob on some of these subjects -- not as criticism, but as clarification of the boundaries so I too can feel more safe. I felt extremely powerless and helpless as the drama you referred to on PSB played out . . . powerless to help defuse it, helpless to offer support or moderation to what was obviously a misunderstanding (regardless of the personal dynamics behind it on either side.) I was torn by my "white knight on a horse" instincts to gallop to jyl's defense, but paralyzed to find a way to do so without risking being blocked myself because I don't think I understand fully enough what the boundaries are. If I got myself blocked, I'm no help to anyone -- but is getting blocked while defending someone else a worthy enough endeavor that the block is worth in considering the value in support it gives the person you are defending? But due to the "progressive discipline" approach to blocking, (which I do agree with, by the way, most of the time at least) -- is it worth it to blow my first "offense" in someone else's defense? Would this exempt me from the "double duration" progression if and when and if I say or do something worthy of intervention in the future?
Once I can clarify my thoughts and ask for specific solutions, I plan to bring up these things with Dr. Bob. But I'm still too unclear on my own feelings and role, that I'm not going to ask until I can clarify things well enough he doesn't have to write me a book in response, as I know how much work moderating this site must be.
What I want to say to you is, I truly deeply appreciate the honesty and passion you have brought to this forum, and your well-defined thoughts and ideas. It is rare to find someone with both open-mindedness and strong opinions, and I feel like you have both. I fully understand if you feel like you are gaining more stress than it's worth to continue here, but I hope that's a decision you reach in reason and not in passion (if that makes any sense.) I have been deeply touched by your voice and support in the short time you've been here, and will miss you if you decide you must go. I know you have a very full life and lots of things pulling you in different directions, and am amazed at your ability to keep it all together. I wish you only the very best, and want you to know that you have made a lasting impression on me. May God bless you always.
Peace and love to you and yours
bozeman
Posted by fayeroe on March 29, 2003, at 15:16:46
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » fayeroe , posted by bozeman on March 29, 2003, at 14:18:40
Bozeman: thank you so very much for your wonderful words of understanding. You've made me feel much better about my decisions concerning the moderation of the site. I've really felt pretty much like an outsider on the site and really do appreciate your comments. I was so stressed over that situation that was going on that day and couldn't really see a reason for it. We're all here because we made the choice to be here and mostly because we are ill and want to belong somewhere. I isolate myself tremendously here in my town and was so relieved to find others who feel like i do. wordfan is one. you.
many more. i don't think i made the decision out of passion but reason. I had tossed and turned in bed thinking about it and decided that I had to fish or cut bait!!! xxoxoxo pat
Posted by justyourlaugh on March 29, 2003, at 15:40:21
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » bozeman, posted by fayeroe on March 29, 2003, at 15:16:46
fay,,i live in a small town...
i only leave the house to get groceries or drive the kids about...
i dont feel connected to"anything"outside my door..
i feel trapped in myself and my dissosociated world...
booze..that was such a nice post to read today from you...
thankyou
peace
jyl(but mojo@jays now)
Posted by mair on March 29, 2003, at 21:11:33
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » bozeman, posted by fayeroe on March 29, 2003, at 15:16:46
Pat
I, too, live in a small town which is part of a more populous area, but hardly a metropolis by any measure. For the most part I always felt the need to be very private about my depression which also meant that I isolated myself and limited my support resources. Finding this site for the first time was wonderful. It's definitely helped my feel less isolated much of the time and I think it's helped me reach a level of comfort with my illness so that I no longer feel as guarded about it or as defensive anyway. One thing that happens when you keep your illness secret is that you don't find out about anyone else's either. This site made me realize that there were lots of people like me.
I've certainly had my ups and downs with this site and I find that i periodically have to take breaks. I've also gotten a little better about avoiding posters or threads that I know are going to upset me for one reason or another and I've gotten a better sense of what administrative battles can be fought and which ones are a waste of time and emotional energy. You sort of have to find the right balance so you can draw positive things from the Board without being pulled down by negative things.
All of this is a very round about way of saying that if you do leave, I hope you look at it as a temporary absence. I think you've added alot and I think there are things we can offer you, particularly if you are as isolated as you say. You may just need to keep plugging away to figure out your right balance.
Mair
PS: Virtually every old timer on this Board has announced that he or she was leaving at least once only to keep return later. Later was sometimes the next day. Don't feel that you've boxed yourself in.
Posted by fayeroe on March 29, 2003, at 21:27:22
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » fayeroe , posted by mair on March 29, 2003, at 21:11:33
mair, if i worried about boxing myself in...i would be in the basement by now! as my oldest sister says "i can always make a decision...it may be the wrong one, but it's a decision."
i'm still posting on the book site and loving it.
my main concern here is with the fact that so many of the people need to feel a part of a community that is pretty much unconditional and i am not seeing that. so, i'm reading all the responses to me and treasuring each one and moving along. i was so pleased that today, while i made greeting cards, that i found the NCAA tournament on internet radio! so i've had a pretty fabulous day. thank you so much for your caring. pat
Posted by bozeman on March 30, 2003, at 1:04:16
In reply to fay-booze, posted by justyourlaugh on March 29, 2003, at 15:40:21
You are welcome, jyl
I'm glad to see you feeling better. You sound good.
I meant everything I said and I will see you around, at jay's if not here. Take care and do what you need to to feel safe and good about yourself, OK? Remember we love you, and so do I.Peace and hugs (from one artist-girl to another :-)
bozeman
Posted by Dinah on March 30, 2003, at 8:14:56
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » fayeroe , posted by bozeman on March 29, 2003, at 14:18:40
I hope Dr. Bob is able to answer a few of your questions about the civility rules. But I just wanted to reassure you of a few points. The administrative actions aren't always linear. Dr. Bob never blocks anyone, no matter how grave the offense, without giving a warning, and never blocks anyone for more than one week without blocking them for a week first, no matter how grave the offense.
However, just because you receive a PBC, it doesn't automatically mean that you'll be blocked next time. And just because you were blocked one week last time, doesn't mean this time will be two. It just means Dr. Bob can do it, not that he will. He uses a lot of discretion, but always in favor of reducing the administrative action.
And you seem to have a real talent with words, and I'm pretty sure can offer support in positive terms rather than negative terms, which is always ok.
If you glance over the administrative actions, you can see a pretty reliable pattern to them (with the occasional glaring exception). Which doesn't mean you can predict Dr. Bob's actions exactly. But that in retrospect his reasons are clear enough (almost always).
Posted by fayeroe on March 30, 2003, at 10:57:51
In reply to Re: fay-booze » justyourlaugh, posted by bozeman on March 30, 2003, at 1:04:16
calling all girl artists! let's grab a cup of tea and talk about our next project. see you at jay's.
jyl, thanks for your message! pat
Posted by fayeroe on March 30, 2003, at 11:19:06
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » bozeman, posted by Dinah on March 30, 2003, at 8:14:56
> I hope Dr. Bob is able to answer a few of your questions about the civility rules. But I just wanted to reassure you of a few points. The administrative actions aren't always linear. Dr. Bob never blocks anyone, no matter how grave the offense, without giving a warning, and never blocks anyone for more than one week without blocking them for a week first, no matter how grave the offense.
>
> However, just because you receive a PBC, it doesn't automatically mean that you'll be blocked next time. And just because you were blocked one week last time, doesn't mean this time will be two. It just means Dr. Bob can do it, not that he will. He uses a lot of discretion, but always in favor of reducing the administrative action.
>
> And you seem to have a real talent with words, and I'm pretty sure can offer support in positive terms rather than negative terms, which is always ok.
>
> If you glance over the administrative actions, you can see a pretty reliable pattern to them (with the occasional glaring exception). Which doesn't mean you can predict Dr. Bob's actions exactly. But that in retrospect his reasons are clear enough (almost always).Thanks, Dinah. I think I have a pretty good overview because I've read most of the recent posts. I appreciate your comments very much and I would hope to make a positive contribution because we all need it. I enjoy your posts very much. You are very insightful. Pat
Posted by noa on March 30, 2003, at 12:21:22
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » fayeroe , posted by mair on March 29, 2003, at 21:11:33
I took a long break once when things got too heated here.
And another break for a while when I was too busy.
And I'm here now.
Mair's right. Sometimes a break is good, but it doesn't have to be final.
Posted by fayeroe on March 30, 2003, at 12:23:48
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site, posted by noa on March 30, 2003, at 12:21:22
> I took a long break once when things got too heated here.
>
> And another break for a while when I was too busy.
>
> And I'm here now.
>
> Mair's right. Sometimes a break is good, but it doesn't have to be final.thanks, noa! i really appreciate your comments. i enjoy your posts and am glad that you are here. pat
Posted by bozeman on March 30, 2003, at 19:18:43
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » bozeman, posted by Dinah on March 30, 2003, at 8:14:56
Thanks, Dinah. Like you, I dread of getting in trouble and / or being a bad girl. I'm much better than I used to be, and it only gets me sometimes, but my neurosis kicked in full-force over this situation.
I hate feeling powerless. I hate being misunderstood. I hate watching other people be misunderstood. I hate watching people be maligned. And most of all, I hate waste -- the kind of waste that happens when misunderstandings take place where one person gets maligned because the other person misunderstood, and since emotions kick in, (and communication is more art than science) a simple miscommunication turns into a battle where words fly, feelings get hurt, injuries happen, people take sides, more people get their feelings hurt, more words fly, and those who don't participate are left feeling powerless (as likely do many of the participants.)
Thank you very much for your vote of confidence regarding my ability to express myself with the written word, but it's more directness than skill, actually. The biggest part of it is honesty. I'm as transparent as glass, and what I think and feel comes through in my writing in spades. That's why trying to "moderate" myself is so hard. It's not an effort for me to be "civil" 99.9% of the time because that's how I naturally am. I was raised to be polite and it's my usual response. It's the rest of the time where I really don't *feel* particularly civil that's the problem. I couldn't think of a single thing I could say that wouldn't get me PBC'd or directly blocked, and there should have been something. I struggled to find it, but I couldn't. :-( That's why I plan to ask some specific questions when I have enough distance to analyze what went wrong (on my part.)
I really appreciate your support with this particularly (for me) troubling issue.
With the deepest affection and respect
bozeman
Posted by Dr. Bob on March 30, 2003, at 20:22:07
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » mair, posted by fayeroe on March 29, 2003, at 21:27:22
> so many of the people need to feel a part of a community that is pretty much unconditional
Well, it did start out unconditional here, but that didn't work. :-(
Bob
Posted by Dinah on April 3, 2003, at 7:30:27
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » Dinah, posted by bozeman on March 30, 2003, at 19:18:43
Actually, I was thinking that the second paragraph of the post I'm responding to is about as good as good as anyone could have said in the circumstances.
As I said, I still have great faith in your abilities to say positive things, even if you may have an uncivil thought or two straying around your mind.
With the deepest affection and respect from me as well,
Dinah
Posted by fayeroe on April 3, 2003, at 9:46:57
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site, posted by Dr. Bob on March 30, 2003, at 20:22:07
> > so many of the people need to feel a part of a community that is pretty much unconditional
>
> Well, it did start out unconditional here, but that didn't work. :-(
>
> Bobwhy do you think it didn't work? and when did it quit working?
Pat
Posted by Dr. Bob on April 3, 2003, at 13:00:08
In reply to Re: controlling/moderation of this site » Dr. Bob, posted by fayeroe on April 3, 2003, at 9:46:57
> why do you think it didn't work? and when did it quit working?
It's all in the archives. Go back and see for yourself? :-)
Bob
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Administration | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.