![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 25 to 49 of 49. Go back in thread:
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 14:44:02
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread, posted by oracle on November 27, 2002, at 14:24:37
oracle,
You wrote, [what happens if they post and say they are a Baptist...]
There have been posters here declaring their religious affiliations. I have seen posters declaring that thy were Catholic, Morman,Jewish,Witnesses for Jahovah, Wiccain, Budahist, Zen, and others and nothing has happenend to them. Is there something that I am missing in your question?
Lou
Posted by Dinah on November 27, 2002, at 14:49:03
In reply to Good idea, posted by NikkiT2 on November 27, 2002, at 11:03:05
I think if Dr. Bob hesitates to delete posts himself, he would be extremely unlikely to allow us to delete our own.
I also think it would lead to problems. Someone could post something provocative, wait for a response, then delete the original post. This would lead the responding poster to look bad, and leave everyone generally confused. For the most part, I agree with Dr. Bob's policy of preserving threads intact.
I just think exceptions should be made, and I think Dr. Bob's compromise of allowing the people involved on this thread to request deletion of certain information is a fair one.
Posted by Dinah on November 27, 2002, at 15:02:12
In reply to me again » Dr. Bob, posted by rayww on November 27, 2002, at 10:17:08
Hi Ray,
I think Dr. Bob has proposed a reasonable solution to this particular problem. And I was reluctant to bring up this at all for fear of drawing attention to the thread, as I stated in my post.
Moreover, I don't think all objectionable or uncivil posts should be removed. However, a situation like this seems like two offenses. The original offense is the posting of an offensive post. The second offense is those in power allowing such a post to remain in public view. I think Dr. Bob sees that, and that is why he is allowing the posters involved to request deletion. It's like if something nasty was written about someone on a wall. Writing it is wrong, but not cleaning it off is also wrong. That's not sweeping graffiti under the rug, it's just simple thoughtfulness.
Also, I appreciate the fact that Dr. Bob shows us the honor and dignity of holding us accountable for our actions, mood disorders or no.
Posted by Tabitha on November 27, 2002, at 15:06:16
In reply to Re: Good idea, posted by Dinah on November 27, 2002, at 14:49:03
>
> I just think exceptions should be made, and I think Dr. Bob's compromise of allowing the people involved on this thread to request deletion of certain information is a fair one.I second that. We all expect anonymity here, unless we choose to post personal information, which very few do. If someone should post personal information (or worse yet, false information) without our permission, either accidentally or maliciously, we ought to be able to have it removed from the board.
Posted by oracle on November 27, 2002, at 15:26:20
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread » oracle, posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 14:44:02
Is there something that I am missing in your question?
> Lou
Quite a bit, Lou.
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 15:33:28
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread, posted by oracle on November 27, 2002, at 15:26:20
oracle,
You wrote,[quite a bit, Lou].
Could you reveal what I am missing in your post that said,[what if they say that they are a Baptist...]? If you could, then I could be better able to communicate with you in regards to understanding your question about [what if they post that they are a Baptist?].
Thanks,
Lou
Posted by oracle on November 27, 2002, at 16:34:57
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread » oracle, posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 15:33:28
> oracle,
> You wrote,[quite a bit, Lou].
> Could you reveal what I am missing in your post that said,[what if they say that they are a Baptist...]? If you could, then I could be better able to communicate with you in regards to understanding your question about [what if they post that they are a Baptist?].
> Thanks,
> Lou
nope
Posted by IsoM on November 27, 2002, at 17:41:30
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread » oracle, posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 14:44:02
I think you're reading far more into posts than have been said, Lou. You state that others have said they were "Catholic, Morman,Jewish,Witnesses for Jahovah, Wiccain, Budahist, Zen" before, but I don't recall every one of these faiths being mentioned by others. Some have been but I think you're going beyond & reading what you think they may be.
Besides, I do have a strong faith & believe in Jesus. But I KNEW that Wendy was just being silly - goofy - & while not everyone might have laughed at it, I again KNEW she wasn't being serious & I'm sure they did too. I was NOT insulted or upset & got a smile from her goofiness.
Should everything we say be couched in serious terms, no levity at all allowed? When W.C. Fields was asked if he liked children. He said he did if they were properly cooked. It's obvious that even if he wasn't fond of children, that he was joking - he didn't eat children, any more than Wendy drinks blood, regardless of whether she does or doesn't believe in Jesus.
It was a JOKE, nothing more, nothing less. Does every last statement made here have to be carefully elaborated on for every possible misinterpretation?
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 18:55:35
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread » Lou Pilder, posted by IsoM on November 27, 2002, at 17:41:30
IsoM,
Wendy's post goes to an international audiance and there are religious people that could see her post as objectionable.I know a Christiandom person whose faith does not allow joking. He bases this on a verse from his bible that says,[ but sexual sins should not be named among you, nether foolish talking, coarse jesting, which is not fitting, but rather giving of thanks.] And another verse,[ ...walk circumspectfully,...]
Now I do not beleive that talking about the type of joke that you used as an example falls into the catargory that the Christiandom person that holds the formentioned verses to prohibit. I beleive that the [foolish talking and coarse jesting] that they object to involves matters of faith. And that, to him, would include joking about [being a satanist and eating blood ]
Lou
Posted by IsoM on November 27, 2002, at 19:25:37
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread » IsoM, posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 18:55:35
Lou: "Now I do not beleive that talking about the type of joke that you used as an example falls into the catargory that the Christiandom person that holds the formentioned verses to prohibit."
IsoM: So the idea of eating children, cooked or otherwise, is fine?
Hmm, what sort of distinction is there about a prohibition on drinking blood & that on eating children? Both wouldn't be considered wrong in God's eye?
- - -Lou: "I know a Christiandom person whose faith does not allow joking."
IsoM: Humour is found anywhere, even in serious discussions, & serves to enliven the discourse, peak the interest of the audience, used as an analogy, & to drive a point home. And if said person finds many different examples of humour bothersome regarding his conscience & beliefs, then I'd suggest such persons to avoid the internet. There's no one that won't be bothered by something at almmost any site they visit. Personally, I object to Disney (seriously) & so avoid any sites to do with such things. There's other things I find objectionable & avoid those too. I suggest the same for your friend.
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 19:40:34
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread » Lou Pilder, posted by IsoM on November 27, 2002, at 17:41:30
Iso M,
You wrote,[...I have a strong faith and believe in Jesus.]
Now I have talked to my Christiandom friend about the post in question and he said to me that he considers the post objectionable and would violate his beliefe to not jest in that manner, since it is on the faith board. He also said that Jesus called the devil the enemy. My friend also cited a verse from his bible that said,[be you angry, but sin not. Do not let the sun go down upon your wrath. Neither give place to the devil.]
My friend also cited another verse from his bible,[resist the devil and he shall flee]. My friend also said that [Jesus came to destroy the works of the devil] and that the devil is the father of all lies.
Wendy is not being condemned by anyone here. Dr Bob just said that the post was not supportive. And I agree with Dr. Bob on this. And reasonable people disagree. I hope that we let not our disagreement keep us from communicating.
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 19:57:08
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread » Lou Pilder, posted by IsoM on November 27, 2002, at 19:25:37
Iso M.
You wrote,[humour is found enywhere...]. Yes, and in my Jewish Bible, it is written that [To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven.]
A time to weep and a time to laugh....
It is the [place] that is the issue here. The post could be posted on the other boards,if allowable, but on the faith board, it has been deemed to be unsupportive.
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 20:27:25
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread » Lou Pilder, posted by IsoM on November 27, 2002, at 19:25:37
Iso M,
I also have an Islamic friend and I asked him also to examine the issue here. He also deemed the post to be offensive to him and said that in Islam, you do not joke about satan.
Islam, he says, requirers a submission to God and that means , to him, nothing concerning humor in regards to satan should be entertained in regards to Islamic faith.
Lou
Posted by NikkiT2 on November 28, 2002, at 6:34:16
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread (2) » IsoM, posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 19:40:34
Could I ask a question??
Blood taking IS part of other religions... but because Christiandom objects, we should nto talk about it??
Because "your friend" objects to humour, we should leave all humour aside??It seems, in these posts, that you would like the faith board to be soley for posts regarding the faith's relating to Christ??
I object to many things in ife, but I don't ask for them to be wiped out. I object to people using tjeir cars for short journeys, for not car sharing, but do I propose we can no longer talk baout cars on this board?
I object to the American way of raising cattle (using growth hormones etc, which is outlawed int eh UK), but do I say no one should mention cows on these boards?
The main thing I object to (at the moment) is the idea my life would be so much better if I could just find room for god!!! But do i ask for you to stop hinting at such things??Limke IsoM said, there are things we all object to in life, but we learn to live around them, bite our tongue once in a while, and avoid the htings that may trigger unhappiness.
You seem to want to faith board to be on your terms, and your terms alone. I thought faith encompassed so many thoughts, feelings and ideas. Maybe I'm just being naiive.
Nikki
Posted by NikkiT2 on November 28, 2002, at 6:38:32
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread-my friends » IsoM, posted by Lou Pilder on November 27, 2002, at 20:27:25
LOU:"I also have an Islamic friend and I asked him also to examine the issue here. He also deemed the post to be offensive to him and said that in Islam, you do not joke about satan.
Islam, he says, requirers a submission to God and that means , to him, nothing concerning humor in regards to satan should be entertained in regards to Islamic faith."ME: I asked my islamic friend, and he thought it funny. I asked a buddhist friend, and she found it amusing, I asked a Protestant friend, and he found it a little funny. I asked a baptist, who founf it funny. A catholic said it was kind of amusing!!
Not one person in my straw poll (32 replies on another site) found it offensive!!! I'm sure other religions must have been covered, by the very nature of the site I used, but they didn't state their religious preference!Nikki
Posted by oracle on November 29, 2002, at 18:37:37
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread (2) » Lou Pilder, posted by NikkiT2 on November 28, 2002, at 6:34:16
> It seems, in these posts, that you would like the faith board to be soley for posts regarding the faith's relating to Christ??
>It seems ? Actually, I think that is the way it is.
We can talk only about the christian god. We cannot ask questionss of each other about any gods (this god is very fragile, I guess)It seems is only OK to preach, we can tell but we cannot ask. I have asked Dr Bob about this several times, but communication with him is one way.
Bob created the faith board to let Lou preach, and is defending it for this reason, only.
But no one is listening because there is no dialogue on that board.
Posted by medlib on November 30, 2002, at 0:27:58
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread (2), posted by oracle on November 29, 2002, at 18:37:37
> Bob created the faith board to let Lou preach, and is defending it for this reason, only.Please do not post anything that could lead others to feel put down.
Guidelines regarding civility can be found at
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
Thank you,
medlib (filling in for Dr. Bob)
Posted by gabbix2 on November 30, 2002, at 0:35:01
In reply to Please Be Civil » oracle, posted by medlib on November 30, 2002, at 0:27:58
I'm wondering if Lou would consider someone saying he was preaching to be a put-down?
Seriously.
Posted by ROO on December 1, 2002, at 14:39:12
In reply to Re: Please Be Civil, posted by gabbix2 on November 30, 2002, at 0:35:01
I sure hated to see such an ugly thread posted
by Mr. Scott towards my good friend Gabbi. It seemed
unnecessarily viscious and hurtful and character marring.
Luckily, Gabbi's good character speaks for itself...
Posted by wendy b. on December 1, 2002, at 22:37:51
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread (2), posted by oracle on November 29, 2002, at 18:37:37
I am sure, Medlib, with all respect due a Deputy, that many people agree with Oracle's last post, and that he is not being uncivil, he is stating what many of us feel stongly. And our feelings, and our thoughts about our feelings, are civil and stated with all due civility. Many people feel shut out of and excluded from the faith board, partly because it was, in fact, created in hopes that Lou would only speak about his Rider, etc., on there, and stop disrupting other posts on other boards on PB. And I have difficulty with that, cuz I think IsoM or you or any of a host of other people here would be AT LEAST as deserving of a place where they could prattle on about whatever it was that were concerned about on a daily basis...
So to address Lou's post, I care not one whit whether his Islamic friend, or the Christian with no sense of humor, thought my post was out of line. Sorry. However, I take umbrage, and I am offended that I could not, as a Satanist, if I were one, post about my faith on the faith board. It IS a religious / cultural / anthropologically-documented form of worship. Just as voodoo is, where animals are sacrificed as part of the ritual. So if I did practice the art of devil-worship or voodoo (not saying they are the same, but making a point that they're both "alternative," or let's say: multi-cultural), which would be MY worship, why would PBF NOT be a place where I could express my views? Why would I be deemed un-worthy of support? That is the jist of my argument, or critique, or whatever. Some practices are worthy of support, and others are not.
And look, I don't really CARE all that much about the faith board, but I'm just saying that the raison-d'etre of this board is highly suspect and quite problematic, from its inception on down the line. Whether you, Medlib, or Bob, or anyone else whose religious views are "among the tolerated" wants to admit it or not.
Sorry, but we continue to be dismayed by the behavior of the management...
Sincerely,
Wendy
Posted by Lou Pilder on December 2, 2002, at 13:47:23
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread (2), posted by wendy b. on December 1, 2002, at 22:37:51
wendy b,
You wrote that [...many feel strongly..]. I think that your posts do contribute, for reasonable people can and do disagree.
There are restraints given on the opening page to the faith board and I am also restricted in my posts.
I have been invited off this forum. You wrote that the faith board , [... in fact created in hopes that Lou would speak about his Rider.. and stop disrupting other posts...]
I wish not to be a disrupting influence here.
Best regards,
Lou
Posted by Dinah on December 2, 2002, at 18:13:58
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread (2) » wendy b., posted by Lou Pilder on December 2, 2002, at 13:47:23
Lou,
I am terribly sad if your feelings have been hurt. I hope you remember that you have never been invited off this forum by Dr. Bob, who has made it abundantly clear that anyone who is willing to abide by the rules of the board is welcome here, and due the full respect accorded by the site's civility rules.
For whatever it's worth, I have always seen you as an inspirational influence to me for the way you never return unkindness for unkindness. I would hope to be as forgiving as you, although I always fall short of what I would like to be. Also, I appreciate how you have frequently shown me kindness when I was feeling down.
Dinah
Posted by Lou Pilder on December 2, 2002, at 20:46:16
In reply to Re: Psycho Babble thread (2) » Lou Pilder, posted by Dinah on December 2, 2002, at 18:13:58
D,
You wrote, [...you have never been invited off this forum by [Dr. Bob]...]
I would like you to know that the invitation to be [off this forum] is external.
Your comments that I have been [inspirational] to you are greatly appreciated.
Best regards,
Lou
Posted by oracle on December 3, 2002, at 18:18:58
In reply to Please Be Civil » oracle, posted by medlib on November 30, 2002, at 0:27:58
>
> > Bob created the faith board to let Lou preach, and is defending it for this reason, only.OK, I will rephrase. Lou may or may not be
preaching depending on the end users context.However, I feel preached to, by Lou. That is the
way I feel, and my feeling are valid.
Posted by rayww on December 4, 2002, at 15:39:46
In reply to Re: Please Be Civil, posted by oracle on December 3, 2002, at 18:18:58
> > >
> However, I feel preached to, by Lou. That is the
> way I feel, and my feeling are valid.oracle you feel preached to by me as well. I wish I could help you understand that there is a very real spiritual swing that can go way out in bipolar disorder. I hated to recognize this because it was so embarrasing, but my family brought it to my attention a few years ago.
I think the faith board is not so much for dialogue, as for expression. When I have a spiritual idea I will usually just start writing and it will come out as I write. When I am finished writing it feels expressed and I can breathe a sigh of relief and close the book. Maybe I don't consider how it will affect others, but I'm not so sure that is the purpose of the faith board.
I disagree with banning writers from the faith board unless flaming occurs in the dialogue that follows. Frankly, I don't see why there should be a need to disagree on the faith board. Can't there just be an understanding that anyone can believe what they want? ANd if someone asks a question, can't we feel free to swing with our opinions? I agree with the "please be civil" rule, but not with the rules that govern said civility. The faith board will survive, but still needs tuning. oracle I appreciate reading your views on the subject.
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Administration | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.