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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 25 of 25. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Greg on July 23, 2002, at 14:18:20
Bob,
Why is it myself, KK and others can ask questions of Mr. Pilder, civily I might add, and you instruct us to not pressure him. But he asks for clarifications of questions of nearly every post made to him and never receives a warning. Am I missing something here? I wasn't rude, threatening or sarcastic. I simply wanted a simple answer to a simple question.
Things are not always what they appear to be Bob.
Greg
> > You started this story in January. You claimed it was of the utmost importance and would lead us to a life free of depression. Why then, nearly seven months later, have you still not finished telling it?
> >
> > Greg
>
> > Is this is the only road that leads to the "Crown of Life"? If one does not choose to travel by that road, what happens when one dies?
> >
> > - KK
>
> > please answer my post above, lou...
> > about the road to the crown of life. it is very important to me that you do.
> >
> > - KK
>
> > Please? Thanks!
> >
> > - KK
>
> > can you please answer my question re: is there only one road to the crown? or are the many roads? what happens if one does not meet the conditions?
> >
> > - KK
>
> Please don't pressure others, thanks.
>
> > What are the conditions? And I am wondering if that can be discussed here since that indicates that a person must meet a certain criteria or perform certain acts to get to the Crown, and that's exclusionary like there being only one road to heaven... we'll see how Dr. Bob feels...
> >
> > - KK
>
> What I feel is, saying a road has conditions is different than saying it's the only road.
>
> Bob
Posted by krazy kat on July 23, 2002, at 14:54:51
In reply to Re: please be civil » Dr. Bob, posted by Greg on July 23, 2002, at 14:18:20
Hmmmmm... I'm not sure what to say. Lou could just ignore my posts if he wants to, couldn't he? Isn't it unfair of him to give only partial answers to questions I deem very important? I am trying to understand his message and I cannot do that without answers to specific questions because I cannot follow large posts due to the Depakote I take for Bipolar Disorder. I get lost almost immediately.
Lou misunderstood a few of my questions, I a few of his, so we went back and forth a bit. I was not "pressuring him", I was helping him to see my sincerity and genuine interest. Also, that board gets full sometimes, and I was afraid he was missing my posts.
Did he say he felt pressured? I didn't see that... I'll go check.
Thank you for explaining about the conditions.
Posted by krazy kat on July 23, 2002, at 15:04:45
In reply to Re: please be civil - Dr. Bob, posted by krazy kat on July 23, 2002, at 14:54:51
but i made sure to ask him, just in case. :)
i assure you my intentions are good. I'll keep trying. I'm working on the civility thing and I plan to get it yet! :)
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 24, 2002, at 1:41:25
In reply to Re: please be civil » Dr. Bob, posted by Greg on July 23, 2002, at 14:18:20
> Why is it myself, KK and others can ask questions of Mr. Pilder, civily I might add, and you instruct us to not pressure him. But he asks for clarifications of questions of nearly every post made to him and never receives a warning. Am I missing something here?
Are you saying that his responding to posts by asking for clarifications should be considered pressure?
Bob
Posted by Greg on July 24, 2002, at 8:32:36
In reply to Re: pressure, posted by Dr. Bob on July 24, 2002, at 1:41:25
> > Why is it myself, KK and others can ask questions of Mr. Pilder, civily I might add, and you instruct us to not pressure him. But he asks for clarifications of questions of nearly every post made to him and never receives a warning. Am I missing something here?
>
> Are you saying that his responding to posts by asking for clarifications should be considered pressure?
>
> BobIf I can't ask him nicely why he hasn't fulfilled a promise he made to this community almost 7 months ago without it being considered to be pressuring him, then I would have to consider his asking for clarifications to what I consider to be clear-cut questions pressure as well. So I guess my answer to your question would be yes.
I am an adult, if he doesn't want to answer my question, all he has to do is say so and I'll stop asking.
Bob, this isn't about my getting a PBC. There's been times when I've made questionable posts where I felt I should have gotten one and didn't. I've taken a hiatus away from the sites I frequent, I even left ASH. But I'm feeling like ready to return now. What I don't want is to feel like everytime I post here I have to stop and read, reread and read again before I submit my post. Support isn't always wrapped in a hug, sometimes it comes in some very tough ways. You know that. But I think most of us here are intelligent enough to know where to draw the line between tough support and hatefulness. There was a time when you let the members here work out there own problems and only stepped in when it was absolutely necessary, and that worked out well for the most part. Now it seems that you jump in at what you percieve to be the first sign of trouble, and IMHO that's not working at all. I can only speak for myself, but it makes me feel very untrusted. Rules are a necessary part of a site like this, but too many rules are killing the very essence of what makes this site special and different from the rest. I percieve you to be an intelligent man, you know when it's the right time to draw the line.
I do want to thank you for the time and the effort you put into running this site, I know it's a daunting task. Consider giving the members here a little more leeway, let us work out our problems. If there's something we can't handle, we'll ask for help. It worked before, it can work again.
Greg
Posted by Lou Pilder on July 24, 2002, at 15:55:36
In reply to Re: please be civil » Dr. Bob, posted by Greg on July 23, 2002, at 14:18:20
Greg,
Thank you for your interest in the 7 Gates on the Road to the Crown of Life.
Your first question was about the 7 months that I have been here without completing the Gates. Now you may not be aware that I have been blocked from posting for 11 weeks. Also, there have been times when I had to respond to other issues here that took me away from the Gates.
Your other questions actually are asking me what the 7th Gate is and I haven't reached that yet. When I do, then those questions of yours will be answered.
You see, you could not understand the answer if I gave it now, for ther are the other 2 Gates to go through, yet.
One of them involves the regeneration of your entire nervous system. Not with drugs, but with a process. It is a cleansing process. And the cleanser is put in you, going through your entire being, making you a whole new creature. It is like haveing your whole inner self washed with the water that can cleanse your being. Not the ouside of you, but the part that makes you "feel", "live", have joy, have peace, have fear cast out, have love, and be free. You see, we hve accumulated a lot of "uncleanliness". This uncleanliness has to be washed. It can be washed with the Water Of Life. This water that washes is the Spirit of God. And you will be born again of Water and Spirit.
Jewish people, symbolically and ritualistically, immerse in water to symbolically show a water cleansing oftheir spiritual uncleanliness. You may have read in your bible about John the Baptizer, who was jew, that was performing this ritual to jewish people. But I am going to tell you about a washing of your innermost being by the Spirit of God that will be done by The Living Water.
When I was in the City of Peace, the Rider said to me, " John did baptize with water, but you shall be baptized with he Spirit of God."
Lou
Posted by coral on July 24, 2002, at 19:43:44
In reply to Lou's resonse to reg's post » Greg, posted by Lou Pilder on July 24, 2002, at 15:55:36
" . . . You see, we hve accumulated a lot of "uncleanliness". This uncleanliness has to be washed. It can be washed with the Water Of Life. This water that washes is the Spirit of God. And you will be born again of Water and Spirit. . . ."
Whoa, nellie. I speak for no one else, but I find this statement to be offensive, attacking and demeaning.
Posted by kiddo on July 24, 2002, at 20:12:31
In reply to Lou's resonse to reg's post » Greg, posted by Lou Pilder on July 24, 2002, at 15:55:36
Posted by Rach on July 24, 2002, at 20:20:55
In reply to Re: pressure » Dr. Bob, posted by Greg on July 24, 2002, at 8:32:36
ASH???
Please email me.
R
Posted by Lou Pilder on July 24, 2002, at 20:32:03
In reply to Re: Lou's resonse to reg's post » Greg, posted by coral on July 24, 2002, at 19:43:44
Coral,
My apologys. I did state my own observation as to the condition of the human race. I should not have done that on this board. I made a mistake. I could have made that statement if there were no restrictions on speech here. But there is, and I have tried to stay within the admin. rules, but I admit that I have failed. This also answers one of Greg's questions as to why I have taken so long to finish. For I could be subject to another block for my tresspass, and that would probably end this discussion for a long time. Now you know why I believe in freedom of speech
You are correct in considering the statement offensive if you do not believe that "all we like sheep have gone astray"
You are correct in considering the statement demeaning if you consider yourself to be perfectly clean, spiritually.
Lou
Posted by Greg on July 24, 2002, at 21:30:04
In reply to Lou's resonse to reg's post » Greg, posted by Lou Pilder on July 24, 2002, at 15:55:36
Lou,
A misunderstanding has taken place here, and for that I apologize. I did not ask my question of you because I wanted or needed any further explanation of your beliefs or experiences. I am a Methodist and do not share your beliefs. I have chosen to fight my disease thru medication and therapy and will continue to do so until my life leads me down another path, should that time ever arise. I simply wanted to know why it was taking so long to complete your story, a question that I've asked you before. One that I will not ask again.
My only other comment here is that I do feel that it is a travesty that others here are not allowed to speak freely about their beliefs. I have read where you have quoted famous people talking about first amendment rights, liberty and freedom. And while I do not expect you to share other's beliefs, if you truly believe in your own writings, I would think you would fully support anyone's right to express their opinion without recrimination. A right you have been allowed to have.
This is in no way intended to pressure you, I hope you will accept it in the manner it is intended.
Greg
Posted by Lou Pilder on July 24, 2002, at 21:41:55
In reply to Re: A misunderstanding » Lou Pilder, posted by Greg on July 24, 2002, at 21:30:04
Greg,
I have repeatedly championd the right to free speech. I have butted heads with Dr, Bob from the beggining here.
But I also believe that freedom of speech is not absolute. You can restrict speech. But I believe that if speech is restricted, then the restrictions have to be well-defined and applied equally.
Dr. Bob ,IMO, has defined the"wrong road" thought to be restricted. Perhaps as we go along, othe defining of speech will also be given.
I also respect admin. rules and try to abide by them. But this is not always possible due to the human condition.
I accept your apology and I would always be ammical for more discussions with you in the future,
Best Regards,
Lou
Posted by Lou Pilder on July 24, 2002, at 21:57:55
In reply to Re: A misunderstanding » Lou Pilder, posted by Greg on July 24, 2002, at 21:30:04
Greg,
One of the people in the group that I was with was a Methodist also like yourself. His name was Dana. He would sing all the hymms that John Wesley wrote . He refused to listen to radio music and I remember one of the songs that he would sing while we were walking in the woods. The song was, "Amazing Grace".
Lou
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 24, 2002, at 22:25:32
In reply to Re: pressure » Dr. Bob, posted by Greg on July 24, 2002, at 8:32:36
> What I don't want is to feel like everytime I post here I have to stop and read, reread and read again before I submit my post. Support isn't always wrapped in a hug, sometimes it comes in some very tough ways. You know that.
I do. So think of me as tough. :-)
> There was a time when you let the members here work out there own problems and only stepped in when it was absolutely necessary, and that worked out well for the most part. Now it seems that you jump in at what you percieve to be the first sign of trouble
I do think I feel it's necessary to jump in earlier than before. I think it's different now. Maybe more like a big city, whereas it used to be more like a small town?
> Rules are a necessary part of a site like this, but too many rules are killing the very essence of what makes this site special and different from the rest.
What makes this site special is posters supporting each other. Which is the "work" of this site. Can we get back to that?
Bob
Posted by alii on July 24, 2002, at 22:33:18
In reply to Re: being supportive, posted by Dr. Bob on July 24, 2002, at 22:25:32
>>>What makes this site special is posters supporting each other. Which is the "work" of this site. Can we get back to that?
Bob<<<It sure would be nice to get back. Sad that there is no returning to what was.
We can only go forward and with the current upheaval I see no return in the near future.
Posted by Dinah on July 24, 2002, at 22:54:15
In reply to Can we get back to that? » Dr. Bob, posted by alii on July 24, 2002, at 22:33:18
Each as individuals?
Each of us can decide rather or not to reach out and support someone. And I still see a lot of that going on.
Let's not let what is happening on Admin and Faith blind us to the genuine caring that is still being shown by posters like Judy and Dreamer and Sandra Dee and Gabbi and Tabitha and Alii and Jane and Susan and Phil and oh so many others. And that's just Social. I don't read the meds board, but I'm guessing there's lots of support going on there too.
It's up to us what to make of this site. It's not up to Dr. Bob. If you want it to be more supportive, give some support.
I remember this same discussion many months ago when some people were complaining that they didn't post any more because the tone of the board had changed. And I couldn't figure that one out, because part of the reason the tone of the board had changed was because they weren't posting any more.
Posted by Greg on July 25, 2002, at 7:33:27
In reply to You left... » Greg, posted by Rach on July 24, 2002, at 20:20:55
> ASH???
>
> Please email me.
> RI will Rach, when I get home from work this afternoon.
Greg
Posted by coral on July 25, 2002, at 8:07:14
In reply to Lou's resonse coral's post » coral, posted by Lou Pilder on July 24, 2002, at 20:32:03
Dear Lou,
You state, "You are correct in considering the statement offensive if you do not believe that "all we like sheep have gone astray"
You are correct in considering the statement demeaning if you consider yourself to be perfectly clean, spiritually."
I'm confused. It appears that you're telling me what conditions must exist before I can consider something demeaning or offensive. Would that be your call?
Posted by Lou Pilder on July 25, 2002, at 8:30:27
In reply to Re: Lou's resonse coral's post » coral, posted by coral on July 25, 2002, at 8:07:14
Coral,
Could you tell why my post about spiritual cleansing, by the Spirit of God caused you to respond to my post with what you wrote? I believe that if you do,I could better discuss with you since you say, "I'm confused"
Thanks,
Lou
Posted by coral on July 25, 2002, at 9:04:23
In reply to Re: Lou's resonse coral's post » coral » coral, posted by Lou Pilder on July 25, 2002, at 8:30:27
Dear Lou,
What I asked was whether it was your call that certain conditions had to exist for it to be appropriate for me to feel as I do.
Coral
Posted by SandraDee on July 25, 2002, at 9:44:48
In reply to Doesn't that depend on us?, posted by Dinah on July 24, 2002, at 22:54:15
Posted by tina on July 25, 2002, at 14:19:21
In reply to You left... » Greg, posted by Rach on July 24, 2002, at 20:20:55
All good things come to an end Rach. There are more than Greg gone now.
Posted by Rach on July 25, 2002, at 19:43:47
In reply to Re: You left... » Rach, posted by tina on July 25, 2002, at 14:19:21
Tina, transferring this over to PB 2000...
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 26, 2002, at 4:43:53
In reply to Re: Lou's resonse coral's post » coral » coral, posted by coral on July 25, 2002, at 9:04:23
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 31, 2002, at 21:27:06
In reply to Re: could we just let this one go, please? (nm), posted by Dr. Bob on July 26, 2002, at 4:43:53
This is the end of the thread.
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