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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 18 of 18. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by beardedlady on July 12, 2002, at 5:43:19
Dr. Bob:
> Yes, she repeated your exact post. But (what seemed to me to be your) intentions entered into it. It would've been more fair not to have taken intentions into account?
It has, at last, occurred to me that you do this on purpose, as no one can be this thick by accident. Well, almost no one.
We all make mistakes. I don't blame you for an occasional unfair block, like that of Sandra Dee. And I don't blame you for defending the sensitive crowd or for steadfastly sticking to your civility guns or for choosing to ban what you see as offensive language or for any of the other little thorns in our sides of late. In fact, I thank you for bringing together some of the loveliest people I've known.
But I do blame you for all the times you have been wrong and have refused to apologize to the people whose feelings you have hurt. I blame you for your inflexibility. I blame you for your refusal to respond to the whole post (whole person?), rather than just a line. I blame you for all your sarcastic, one-line barbs disguised as cutesy quips and defended with faux innocence.
And I especially blame you for the special type of civility practiced by passive aggressors.
IMHO? It's pretty fucked up.
I hope this experiment will teach you something about human nature, about the fragility and strength of the human soul, about the nuances of language, about what happens when you put lions and tigers and bears, rats and snakes, dogs and cats in the same cage.
beardy
Maybe you can start with this: http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/admin/20020627/msgs/6230.html
Posted by Lini on July 12, 2002, at 10:30:10
In reply to Blocked Forever--beardedlady (For Dr. Bob), posted by beardedlady on July 12, 2002, at 5:43:19
The thing is, I like you. So, all this between you and bob bothers me (probably more my issue, but true all the same). Isn't it possible that you have misunderstood some of Dr. Bob's intentions? You seem to be offended by the way he responds to you/issues but I am not sure that you have interpreted things correctly (maybe you have, I don't know). I just have to assume that he wouldn't go through the trouble of this site and this board if he had (all of) the qualities that you've attributed.
>I blame you for your inflexibility. I blame you >for your refusal to respond to the whole post ?>(whole person?), rather than just a line. I blame >you for all your sarcastic, one-line barbs >disguised as cutesy quips and defended with faux >innocence.
>And I especially blame you for the special type >of civility practiced by passive aggressors.
Now, I am not on the "Dr. Bob is our babbler savior" bandwagon. He messes up and pisses me off and occasionally makes me slam down my laptop . . . but if you've met some of the loveliest people you've known here, than in the "big picture" isn't he probably getting it mostly right?I took a break after all the new boards were implemented. I thought it wasn't the best idea (sorry Greg!) for the community, but other people seem to like it and it seems to work as a whole, so being in the minority, I dealt with it (with the above mentioned expressions of dislike of course).
I guess I am just saying that your dissapointment is well noted, and I think even internalzed by Bob and will probably have some unknown indirect impact on "blocks" in the future. At this point, do you need Dr. Bob to actually post an apology? (actual question, do not read as a sarcastic remark). You just seem to be really bothered by this whole thing and I am wondering what it would take for it to be okay for you.
Posted by IsoM on July 12, 2002, at 11:41:38
In reply to Re: Blocked Forever--beardedlady (For Dr. Bob) » beardedlady, posted by Lini on July 12, 2002, at 10:30:10
Lini, you wrote:
" . . . but if you've met some of the loveliest people you've known here, than in the "big picture" isn't he probably getting it mostly right?"
No, he's not getting it mostly right.Think of a new store opening that purports to offer various products that people have really needed, not just wanted, but were unable to find elsewhere. In the main display area are many different products that are eagerly bought, just what is needed.
Different diplay areas now branch off the main room but as customers stroll through these rooms, a number of them find shoddy products, over-priced products, & even products that don't belong in such a store.
Disappointed that the store didn't live up to their expectations (but they did get some good things in the main display area), they leave while the store is still packed with other shoppers. Those leaving discuss together the idea of opening their own cooperative to truly offer what they agree is needed.
I wouldn't say that the store is mostly getting it right. What I would say is it brought together different people who agreed on what's truly needed that otherwise wouldn't have met each other. Nothing more. Meanwhile, other shoppers seem happy enough with the store & continue shopping there.
Sorry for the silly analogy but I wanted to make it clear.
Posted by Dinah on July 12, 2002, at 11:59:03
In reply to Re: Blocked Forever--beardedlady » Lini, posted by IsoM on July 12, 2002, at 11:41:38
It's the anger I don't understand. Even if Dr. Bob is not providing what you want, why the anger? I have always (and still do) consider you a rational and good natured person, and I just don't understand all this anger towards Bob. Even if he did make a mistake, why all the attribution of bad motives to him? Now I may be getting your specific posts confused with all the other posts on the subject. And it may well not have been you that expressed a lot of anger towards Dr. Bob or attributed bad motives to him. But maybe you could explain it anyway.
Please don't anyone be angry with me over this. I just genuinely am confused by it. My motivation is just to understand, there is nothing else to my question. I am not attacking anyone or insulting anyone.
Am I the only one who appreciates the amount Dr. Bob manages to convey in his concise statements? So much wit, frequent compassion, and a lot of wisdom... And I rather suspect that he keeps his answers short on purpose, to clarify the nature of his role here. Sure, sometimes he takes a while to "get it" but I see no reason for the amount of anger. I don't think his motives are at all bad. Did something else happen while I was away? The effexor is making it difficult for me to concentrate on the archives.
A totally confused,
Dinah
Posted by judy1 on July 12, 2002, at 12:10:22
In reply to But I don't understand the anger.... » IsoM, posted by Dinah on July 12, 2002, at 11:59:03
It looks like you read my thread on 2000 (and no it's certainly not eavesdropping- it was a safety issue for me). I think trying to make sense of all of this and getting upset has done nothing but make me feel sick and I suspect you may be going down that road. Please read the responses to me and maybe consider the advice. Take care, judy
Posted by Dinah on July 12, 2002, at 12:38:39
In reply to Re: But I don't understand the anger.... » Dinah, posted by judy1 on July 12, 2002, at 12:10:22
You are probably right. Perhaps I should stay out of any thread where anger is involved. Sigh.
But honestly, I usually only have my meltdowns when I'm afraid I've done something wrong. My therapist once asked what to say to me when I was in a meltdown, and I replied "You didn't do anything terrible" or "I don't think you're a terrible person" were two good, all purpose answers. :)
I'm glad Dr. Bob has greater ego strength than I do, and I suppose I shouldn't be so defensive of him.
Thanks for thinking of me.
Dinah
Posted by judy1 on July 12, 2002, at 12:46:30
In reply to Re: Blocked Forever--beardedlady » Lini, posted by IsoM on July 12, 2002, at 11:41:38
I feel absolutely miserable. Can you please stop?
Posted by IsoM on July 12, 2002, at 12:48:15
In reply to But I don't understand the anger.... » IsoM, posted by Dinah on July 12, 2002, at 11:59:03
I know others have felt anger about all this & I thoroughly understand why, but no, I'm not angry. This isn't an emotional issue for me, Dinah, it's the principles behind all this is what's important. I'd be a hypocrite to continue to support something I believe to be inherently wrong. And I'm not angry at you at all for asking. Why ever would I be? I've written you before by email & I hope you know how I think.
Now that doesn't mean we have to agree on everything & while you see Bob as helpful, I see something much more malevolent. Sorry to say so, but initially I thought it all very above-board & helpful too, but as more & more threads were woven into the tapestry, I started to see a different picture emerge. Obviously, we're not seeing the same picture - we're looking at it from different perspectives & probably with different glasses (so to speak).
You see "So much wit, frequent compassion, and a lot of wisdom... And I rather suspect that he keeps his answers short on purpose, to clarify the nature of his role here." I don't - not in the least. Sorry, but I do read people well & have very rarely been wrong. When I have been wrong, it's only been initially before I had enough to really go on. I have enough to go on now.
Posted by IsoM on July 12, 2002, at 12:51:11
In reply to But you're not making us happy 'shopping' » IsoM, posted by judy1 on July 12, 2002, at 12:46:30
Ah, Judy, I don't want to make you miserable. You're much too kind & innocent. Yes, sweetie, I'll stop, I'm truly gone. I'm sure you know how to get in touch with us. As I said, it's really the principles of this, not emotions for me, but obviously, it's a very emotional thing for many.
Posted by Dinah on July 12, 2002, at 12:54:21
In reply to No anger, Dinah... » Dinah, posted by IsoM on July 12, 2002, at 12:48:15
IsoM, would you mind emailing me at bullyforyou77 at yahoo? I really would like to understand the malevolent part, and I do understand that you wouldn't want to get more specific on the board.
Thanks for your many kindnesses.
Dinah
Posted by judy1 on July 12, 2002, at 12:57:46
In reply to Re: But you're not making us happy 'shopping' » judy1, posted by IsoM on July 12, 2002, at 12:51:11
Posted by tabitha on July 13, 2002, at 3:13:24
In reply to But I don't understand the anger.... » IsoM, posted by Dinah on July 12, 2002, at 11:59:03
For what it's worth, I don't understand either, and I've read just about all the posts the past several months, and a good bit of the Admin archives as well.
Difficult as it is to read people in person, and separate out your own projections, it's even harder in print. Maybe that's the real root of all the confusion, ey?
-tabitha
Posted by Dinah on July 13, 2002, at 3:27:26
In reply to I'm confused too » Dinah, posted by tabitha on July 13, 2002, at 3:13:24
> For what it's worth, I don't understand either, and I've read just about all the posts the past several months, and a good bit of the Admin archives as well.
>
> Difficult as it is to read people in person, and separate out your own projections, it's even harder in print. Maybe that's the real root of all the confusion, ey?
>
> -tabithaYou are probably right at that. Perhaps I project overly postive qualities to Dr. Bob because of my generally positive feelings towards authority figures (at least ones with a lot of intelligence and wit). And perhaps others project other things. And I must admit that however much I enjoy Dr. Bob's short and witty replies, they are frequently ambiguous and leave a lot of room for projection.
That does help me understand a bit better. Thanks.
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 13, 2002, at 13:22:46
In reply to Blocked Forever--beardedlady (For Dr. Bob), posted by beardedlady on July 12, 2002, at 5:43:19
> I hope this experiment will teach you something about human nature, about the fragility and strength of the human soul, about the nuances of language, about what happens when you put lions and tigers and bears, rats and snakes, dogs and cats in the same cage.
You all do teach me a lot. IMO, anyway, I know it may not show... And it certainly can be hard for all of us to be together sometimes. As far as language, that "simple poem" of yours:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/social/20020403/msgs/21821.html
has been on my mind since I happened upon it again putting together that memorial for sar. Thanks for all you've contributed, I hope you find greener pastures, and whether you do or not, you're welcome back. Best wishes,
Bob
Posted by beardedlady on July 13, 2002, at 15:18:17
In reply to Re: not Blocked Forever by me, posted by Dr. Bob on July 13, 2002, at 13:22:46
A nice gift. Thank you.
beardy
Posted by Lini on July 14, 2002, at 10:03:07
In reply to Re: not Blocked Forever by me, posted by Dr. Bob on July 13, 2002, at 13:22:46
See?;)
the unforgivable daughter of a social worker,
-L
Posted by fachad on July 16, 2002, at 15:08:36
In reply to Re: Blocked Forever--beardedlady » Lini, posted by IsoM on July 12, 2002, at 11:41:38
IsoM,
When is this new store going to start advertising, and disclosing it's location?
-fachad
> Lini, you wrote:
> " . . . but if you've met some of the loveliest people you've known here, than in the "big picture" isn't he probably getting it mostly right?"
> No, he's not getting it mostly right.
>
> Think of a new store opening that purports to offer various products that people have really needed, not just wanted, but were unable to find elsewhere. In the main display area are many different products that are eagerly bought, just what is needed.
>
> Different diplay areas now branch off the main room but as customers stroll through these rooms, a number of them find shoddy products, over-priced products, & even products that don't belong in such a store.
>
> Disappointed that the store didn't live up to their expectations (but they did get some good things in the main display area), they leave while the store is still packed with other shoppers. Those leaving discuss together the idea of opening their own cooperative to truly offer what they agree is needed.
>
> I wouldn't say that the store is mostly getting it right. What I would say is it brought together different people who agreed on what's truly needed that otherwise wouldn't have met each other. Nothing more. Meanwhile, other shoppers seem happy enough with the store & continue shopping there.
>
> Sorry for the silly analogy but I wanted to make it clear.
Posted by IsoM on July 16, 2002, at 15:29:49
In reply to Re: Blocked Forever--beardedlady » IsoM, posted by fachad on July 16, 2002, at 15:08:36
Email me at isomorphix at hotmail dot com
This is the end of the thread.
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