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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by uncouth on June 21, 2014, at 20:57:29
Nardil at 75mg was working well for a few weeks. Pretty fatigued, but finally feeling the benefits in terms of social anxiety and mood. If anything, got a little hypomanic (but due to the sleep deprivation, see previous post). Now after a rough weekend at home, where I felt some pretty substantial family rejection (which is part of a lifelong pattern), I came back to the city I live feeling terribly depressed and like Nardil just stopped working. No desire to socialize, mood in the toilet, and I don't know what to do. Hope this isn't an actual "crash" from a mild hypomania I was in.
How can I "juice" the nardil so it starts to work again? I wish there was something especially for rejection sensitivity! Independent of anything else, or no matter how I feel, it rejectio ALWAYS feels like it triggers something deep in me, probably from childhood, and it's like a "kill switch" for my mood.
Relatedly, does nardil have a propensity to "poop out"? What does one do then, just pump the dose? Augment?
Posted by Phillipa on June 21, 2014, at 22:48:25
In reply to Nardil stopped working, posted by uncouth on June 21, 2014, at 20:57:29
I read above post. Have you ever not changed the clocks during the time change? We didn't so during the winter got up earlier. During the summer harder. As seems strange to be inside when dark outside. Is melatonin compatible with nardil? Also guessing that the time you spent at home didn't help and you are super anxious. Give yourself some time to settle down. Phillipa
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on June 22, 2014, at 1:45:36
In reply to Nardil stopped working, posted by uncouth on June 21, 2014, at 20:57:29
Avoid your family?
Posted by Lamdage22 on June 22, 2014, at 6:42:55
In reply to Nardil stopped working, posted by uncouth on June 21, 2014, at 20:57:29
Every Med can poop out.
Lamictal, Wellbutrin might be worth a shot, but so is trying to work out your issues with your family.Why do you feel rejected by your family?
Posted by tom2228 on June 22, 2014, at 11:41:55
In reply to Re: Nardil stopped working, posted by Lamdage22 on June 22, 2014, at 6:42:55
> Every Med can poop out.
> Lamictal, Wellbutrin might be worth a shot, but so is trying to work out your issues with your family.
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> Why do you feel rejected by your family?
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Medication can't do everything. It sounds like you having a difficult time psychologically, which can surely contribute to depression even if your meds are working. You also just went up in dose, so you can expect that the feelings you get from the medication are going to vary for a while until you acclimate to the new dose. You may feel better, or worse for a few days, which is subject to change as you adjust. Be careful not to jump to conclusions. It takes patience.In the meantime are you doing therapy? Therapy produces effects in the brain similar to medication, and the effects with therapy are synergistic. Meds are powerful and affect us greatly but they will only do so much if you are not giving attention to your psychological issues. Meds can only cover these up for so long, even the strongest drugs (like meth and heroin) stop working for people over time... that is if you are using them as a cover-up rather than part of a balanced approach to psychiatric issues.
However, meds can surely help us *manage* emotional issues, such as rejection sensitivity. I have found that Lamictal and Abilify in addition to my MAOI have helped me with this. They help me with the intensity of my feelings so that I can think and make decisions more rationally rather than mostly driven by black, white, and intense emotions. But I'm not sure how much help this would be to me if I didn't get out in therapy what the meds help me deal with.
Best,
Tom
Posted by baseball55 on June 22, 2014, at 21:26:04
In reply to Re: Nardil stopped working, posted by tom2228 on June 22, 2014, at 11:41:55
There's a difference between being depressed and just feeling sad, angry, rejected. If you have issues with your family, you are going to have strong emotions that are uncomfortable. This doesn't mean your anti-depressant isn't working. The point of ADs is not to stop all negative emotions. Maybe you need to talk to a therapist about your issues with family.
Posted by atypical on June 24, 2014, at 12:50:48
In reply to Nardil stopped working, posted by uncouth on June 21, 2014, at 20:57:29
I'm not convinced the Nardil stopped working based on what I'm reading. (Hypomania is a frequent side effect when first taking the Nardil, btw.) I experienced that for 3 days. How long have you been on the Nardil? And at 75mg? It takes several months for Nardil to "sink in," so to speak, and have an impact on mood.
You will have ups and downs, and given the experience with your family you might be having the downs now. That kind of psychological pain will drag you down no matter what medications(s) you are taking. If you feel like crying because of the pain, by all means cry! If you feel a little angry, be angry -- go to the gym and punch a punching bag. Read some books or articles to help you get perspective on your pain/rejection issues. I tell you this from experience.
Atypical
Posted by uncouth on June 24, 2014, at 16:46:54
In reply to Re: Nardil stopped working, posted by atypical on June 24, 2014, at 12:50:48
I've been on the nardil for over two months now, and one month at 75mg. Are you saying each dose increase i will experience hypomania, or just when initiating? I am trying a cyclical ketogenic diet to help with weight gain, so far i've lost weight, because the first few weeks i gained a ton so had to put a stop to that. NO carbs now.
I'm a big guy, 225lbs. I only got orthostatic hypotension when I went up to 75mg. Now after 4 weeks, if anything, its felt like its pooped out on me. How high can one go...90 seems pretty standard. Again, its a bit complicated becuase we are also doing this experimental trial with disulfiram at the same time, so I know that has an impact. And I definitely want to avoid hypomania. I just had such a good response, feeling good, pro-social, no anxiety, interested in asking women out on dates, confident, and then the family stuff hit, and it caused some despair, like....no matter what I am on, even something that FINALLY seems to work after so long, i will never be able to totally escape the lifelong rejection my family continues to give me, even at age 34. I've had to spent so much of my own efforts in therapy, with medication, dealing with mental illness few understand (when I went home this time, the first thing my dad said when I mentioned my insomnia was "dont you think its time to get off those meds"...he's a late-stage alcoholic himself!).
Yeah i've done and am doing therapy, tons of it. Group and individual. I work out, go to church, bible study, don't drink anymore, pray, try to do healthy things, but the rage over being sh*t on for so many years still bubbles up from time to time.
I guess i was finally confident I was turning a corner with the nardil, and the reality hit...that medications won't ever solve all of it. But 10 years of therapy hasn't either? If anything, it makes me even more of an outsider dealing with my sick family -- because i see them for what they are.
Posted by baseball55 on June 24, 2014, at 20:40:20
In reply to Re: Nardil stopped working, posted by uncouth on June 24, 2014, at 16:46:54
> I guess i was finally confident I was turning a corner with the nardil, and the reality hit...that medications won't ever solve all of it. But 10 years of therapy hasn't either? If anything, it makes me even more of an outsider dealing with my sick family -- because i see them for what they are.
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Sometimes the only solution to situations like this is to set boundaries and limit your interactions with relatives who are toxic to you. I just left my husband. Before I decided to do this, my psychiatrist talked to me about meds and I said, I'm not depressed. I'm just falling apart. Leaving was the way I coped. Meds were not going to change this toxic situation.
Posted by Chris O on June 26, 2014, at 0:25:14
In reply to Nardil stopped working, posted by uncouth on June 21, 2014, at 20:57:29
I have no advice for the Nardil issue, but I can totally relate to what you say about your family (for me, it's my mother). If I spend any amount of time with them, no matter what I'm taking, all the crappy feelings I experienced growing up come rushing back.
Posted by Lamdage22 on June 27, 2014, at 14:08:29
In reply to Re: Nardil stopped working, posted by uncouth on June 24, 2014, at 16:46:54
No carb sounds good. I feel that a high protein diet is somewhat antidepressant, too.
This is the end of the thread.
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