Shown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by uncouth on April 16, 2014, at 21:42:18
ok team.
lots of nardil talk recently. i ended up (independent of PB) starting on it myself about 3 weeks ago. I am up to 60mg. Feeling minor mood improvement but NO real side effects besides possible increase in hunger/carb/weight (but I did stop vyvanse and phentermine to try nardil so my doc thinks it's likely just that). Haven't felt any of the orthostatic hypotension which i've been told is a "sign" the nardil is actually kicking in (yes?). Definitely felt it when I was on parnate years ago.I read recently some threads here about fixing nardil. Enteric capsules, carmex, etc. I looked at carmex and at least the ones at walgreens, had no carnuaba wax in it (and a load of other junk).
So I bought a brick of pure carnuaba wax from a seller on amazon. It came today, and it's super hard. I melted a little bit in a saucepan, carefully keeping heat low. I took it off, waited for it to cool down a bit (but if you wait too long it seemingly instantly hardens) and tossed a few (9) nardils in there, swished them around, and pulled them out with a fork as fast as I could. Let them dry on a paper towel, reheated the wax, and did it again, one or two more times. First round, the liquid was hot, the nardil tablets got a shine on them. Second and third times, they built up a visible coating of wax. I figured i'd over coat, because I could always tell (hopefully) if they came out "the other end".
Took the first one now, and will take the rest of them over the next two days. I will report on any changes and I will try to be mindful of my #2s and if I notice anything shall we say floating or sinking. (Yes, i'll take one for the team).
Wish me luck!
Posted by uncouth on April 16, 2014, at 21:45:26
In reply to I fixed Nardil (well, i'm trying to), posted by uncouth on April 16, 2014, at 21:42:18
Oh, I should also say, don't try this at home kids. And ALSO I forgot to mention. I'm also on a combination of bydureon and victoza, two injectable diabetes drugs (used for weight loss from metabolic syndrome brought on by zyprexa and PEA use a few years back that is almost fully resolved but still stubbornly there about 20%).
These drugs *dramatically* slow (especially in combo) stomach emptying. So although of course I can't be sure, it seems like I'm especially prone to nardil dissolving/absorbing in the stomach rather than intestines.
Not sure how/if at all the wax coating will be dissolved in the gut...any ideas? Maybe just heat? Enxymes?
Posted by Tomatheus on April 17, 2014, at 11:34:02
In reply to I fixed Nardil (well, i'm trying to), posted by uncouth on April 16, 2014, at 21:42:18
Uncouth,
I personally didn't start trying to modify my Nardil until I lost the full-but-temporary response to the medication that I experienced while I was taking 75 mg, and generally, I think it's best to see how you're going to respond to Nardil in its unmodified form before trying different strategies to get it to perform better. Having said this, I hope that you get good results from your experiment with the carnauba wax. I'd be interested in hearing if you feel any different with the coated Nardil that you're taking, as opposed to the way that you've been feeling with regular film-coated Nardil.
Tomatheus
Posted by ed_uk2010 on April 18, 2014, at 6:00:26
In reply to Re: I fixed Nardil (well, i'm trying to), posted by uncouth on April 16, 2014, at 21:45:26
>I'm also on a combination of bydureon and victoza...
Both? These drugs are in the same class. I've never heard of anyone using both together before. How unusual.
Posted by kirkglen on April 18, 2014, at 18:20:34
In reply to Re: I fixed Nardil (well, i'm trying to), posted by ed_uk2010 on April 18, 2014, at 6:00:26
Guys
Pls. reply to the post from /4/14/14 concerning acacia. I'd really like others input. I looked up Atarax and they use it as an additive also. Same company.
Uncouth good luck with the wax..........
Posted by kirkglen on April 19, 2014, at 10:14:19
In reply to Re: I fixed Nardil (well, i'm trying to), posted by kirkglen on April 18, 2014, at 18:20:34
Uncouth
I forgot to ask...are you using Greenstone or Gavis pills?
Posted by Uncouth on April 19, 2014, at 11:06:19
In reply to Re: I fixed Nardil (well, i'm trying to), posted by kirkglen on April 19, 2014, at 10:14:19
Greenstone
So I've gone through two and a half days thus far of this experiment. Can't tell a difference yet though do feel quite fatigued this morning (though I am most mornings, today seems worse). No substantive orthostatic but I forgot my bp cuff at home.Been three and a half weeks so far on Nardil and off Vyvanse. Bummed at the weight gain and increase in hunger or even just the bloating and seems my sleep apnea has gotten worse by my AHI numbers on my machine each morning. So that's not so hot. Anyone know anything about this?
If anything response feels like it's gone away though perhaps I also had just experienced the Nardil initial hypomanic like effects? Nardil does eventually kick in at a reasonable dose after a number of weeks, yes? Because I still can't get out of bed!( not due to mood/deprssion more due to fatigue and motovation). Atrention seems to be improving a bit.
Posted by kirkglen on April 20, 2014, at 18:17:00
In reply to Re: I fixed Nardil (well, i'm trying to), posted by kirkglen on April 19, 2014, at 10:14:19
Uncouth
I'd used Nardil for 30 yrs. prior to the changes. I got off it and tried everything else and nothing works. I'm back on nardil with hope.
One thing I found during my 30 yrs. and today is you have to stay away from sweets. You eat them and you're not getting out of bed the next day and your depression is going to increase. You really have to watch what you eat and keep it healthy. Raisins also knock me for a loop.
Pls. go to www.rxmed.com/NARDIL html. This is the true ingredients Parke Davis had in their formula.
Also do your research on acacia, with a maoi it is psycho active in humans and is used for religious riots. Pls. see my post of 04/13/14.
I don't know if this was why the old formula was so effective. Today I'm trying to find some and try it at a very very reduced level.
Stay with Nardil and good luck with the waxing. Once you read Parke Davis you'll see what level they found to be effective.
Posted by uncouth on April 21, 2014, at 11:56:24
In reply to Re: I fixed Nardil (well, i'm trying to), posted by kirkglen on April 20, 2014, at 18:17:00
Kirk--
Thanks for the reply. I've had about 4 days of the home-made waxed coated Nardil, and it may not have worked. I'm away from home for two weeks so might try it again when I return, and the easter holiday probably threw a wrench in the experiment, but I think I know my mood at this point well enough to say that at least at 60mg, and after being on 60mg for a few weeks, adding wax coating if anything may have backfired and reduced effect, so i'm back to normal for now.
No change in orthostatic hypotension (still none) but man my stomach is gettin bigger :(
i'm VERY curious about your response to sweets, and whether you've figured out what's going on. My hunger has increased on Nardil a bit, and like I said in previous post, I do take two diabetes inejctables to help lose weight/prevent further, but have read Nardil has some complex effects on metabolism right?
BUt how would it affect mood? WHen you say you couldn't get out of bed, what was it from---fatigue/poor sleep? Or because it caused transient depression?
Most days, I try hard to do a intermittant-fasting style diet, with no eating from 9-10pm through mid afternoon the next day (except for small amounts of fats like coconut oil or pumpkin seeds). What that means is I tend to pile in all my calories late in the day/before I go to sleep. I'm definitely noticing my cereal cravings at night going up again (but again I also stopped vyvanse/phentermine for nardil initiation).
I had a big easter dinner yesterday, with lots of sweets for dessert. Felt pretty bad this morning.
What do you think is going on, and have you heard this effect from others?
I really really want Nardil to work. Especially for the social phobia issues. I was holding out high hopes, but 4 weeks in I can't say it's doing much (besides maybe increasing fluency of inner thought/dialogue), with the exception of the first-week semi-hypomanic reaction.
Re: acacia...you know when I was taking bodybuilding supplements/weight loss pills years ago, I recall some extract of acacia being an ingredient. Very curious if you can figure that one out, and why they used it. I think if I recall it has some form of phenylethylamine in it, but to be honest I can't imagine it's there in enough quantity in a Nardil pill to make a difference, but who knows? Maybe with an MAOI even a few mg makes a difference? What's your research strategy on this---how can we figure out why or how much acacia extract old Nardil used?
Best
Uncouth
Posted by kirkglen on April 21, 2014, at 16:22:05
In reply to Re: I fixed Nardil (well, i'm trying to), posted by uncouth on April 21, 2014, at 11:56:24
Uncouth
I do not know why sweets knock me down. My 83 yr. old pdoc has never heard of that. Basically I'm so depressed I have no energy to get out of bed. It's terrible, even on the old formula I'd experience this. But you wake up craving carbs , so you have to discipline yourself.
As to acacia I've read the data on it being psycho active when in the presence of a maoi. I plan on getting some and trying it. Also I've read that kaolin even brings better results.
We're on the "mega AD" and I've been on it for a year since I restarted and am totally not impressed. But you may have some positive results so hang in there.
Posted by kirkglen on April 25, 2014, at 10:25:33
In reply to Re: I fixed Nardil (well, i'm trying to), posted by kirkglen on April 21, 2014, at 16:22:05
Uncouth
My next dr. appt. I'm going to ask for a script of Atarax. It contains "inactive" ingredients acacia and carnauba wax. Funny it's made by Pfizer.
I haven't found any interactions between the two.
Maybe this will be a method of seeing if acacia has an effect with Nardil.Normally it's a antihistamine but is used for anxiety and is non addictive.
This is the end of the thread.
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