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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by gilmourr on October 26, 2012, at 22:06:18
So the more days I'm off Nardil (@ 0 mg) the more I'm starting to think that my side effects of urinary retention, major cold intolerance, constipation @ 60 mg were all caused by too much norepinephrine.
At 45 mg which is my awesome dose (70% efficacy on symptoms) I only have constipation.
My plan was to restart, only to 45 mg and then add nortryptiline. But now that I'm figuring out it was most likely NE which is to blame for my side effects I'm not sure I should use it when I'm at 45 mg. Wouldn't that just elevate my NE level and make me feel like I'm on 60 mg of Nardil? Or is that totally a bunk thought?
I need something with the Nardil since it's not enough. The only things I can think of are..
- Lyrica
- Neurontin
- Nortryptiline
- Amitryptiline
- Wellbutrin
- AbilifyI'm not a huge fan of Lyrica because I think it's going to completely impair my memory while I'm on it.
Should I just stick with Nortryptiline and try it anyways since it's my best shot?
Lets stick to ideas for augmenting Nardil. No monotherapy recommendations please as I would like to try and get Nardil plus another to bring me into remission since I'm close to it when I'm on 45 mg.
TY.
Posted by gilmourr on October 26, 2012, at 22:09:22
In reply to Help with my Nardil restart plan. LF drug opinions, posted by gilmourr on October 26, 2012, at 22:06:18
Also what about lithium (small dose)? I heard it lowers NE and increases SERT. I'm not Bi-polar, I have major depression and panic disorder + agoraphobic issues (mild atm)
Posted by gilmourr on October 28, 2012, at 1:17:42
In reply to Re: Help with my Nardil restart plan. LF drug opinions, posted by gilmourr on October 26, 2012, at 22:09:22
I guess wellbutrin may be out of the picture as well since it is an inhibitor of the CYP2D6 enzyme.
Last time I touched inhibitors of the CYP450 system, it messed my nardil up. One example was a proton pump inhibitor another was clarithromycin.
Posted by jono_in_adelaide on October 28, 2012, at 2:37:18
In reply to Help with my Nardil restart plan. LF drug opinions, posted by gilmourr on October 26, 2012, at 22:06:18
Try Nardil + nortriptyline, I think its unlikely that your side effects were due to an excess of noradrenalin, because nardil (in a round about way) can actualy reduce avaliable noradrenalin - thats why Nardil + Nortriptyline is such a logical combination
Posted by gilmourr on October 28, 2012, at 14:26:16
In reply to Re: Help with my Nardil restart plan. LF drug opinions, posted by jono_in_adelaide on October 28, 2012, at 2:37:18
> Try Nardil + nortriptyline, I think its unlikely that your side effects were due to an excess of noradrenalin, because nardil (in a round about way) can actualy reduce avaliable noradrenalin - thats why Nardil + Nortriptyline is such a logical combination
But then why did I become freezing cold 24/7 even in hot temperatures inside at 60 mg? I also had NE side effects like urinary retention, constipation and hyper reflexes. What would be the cause of my extreme coldness? (Day 8 or 9 on 0 mg right now, chills are diminishing more)
Posted by phidippus on October 28, 2012, at 21:36:38
In reply to Help with my Nardil restart plan. LF drug opinions, posted by gilmourr on October 26, 2012, at 22:06:18
>Wouldn't that just elevate my NE level and make me feel like I'm on 60 mg of Nardil? Or is that totally a bunk thought?
not a bunk thought-I don't think it will make you feel like you're on a higher dose of Nardil. I think it might make you anxious though. Norepenephrine is a tricky bugger.
- Lyrica - Can cause depression
- Neurontin - Can cause depression
- Nortryptiline - good augmentation strategy
- Amitryptiline - May be too dirty
- Wellbutrin - excellent augmentation strategy>Should I just stick with Nortryptiline and try it anyways since it's my best shot?
I think Wellbutrin is a better choice.
Eric
- Abilify
Posted by gilmourr on October 28, 2012, at 22:02:08
In reply to Re: Help with my Nardil restart plan. LF drug opinions » gilmourr, posted by phidippus on October 28, 2012, at 21:36:38
> >Wouldn't that just elevate my NE level and make me feel like I'm on 60 mg of Nardil? Or is that totally a bunk thought?
>
> not a bunk thought-I don't think it will make you feel like you're on a higher dose of Nardil. I think it might make you anxious though. Norepenephrine is a tricky bugger.
>
> - Lyrica - Can cause depression
> - Neurontin - Can cause depression
> - Nortryptiline - good augmentation strategy
> - Amitryptiline - May be too dirty
> - Wellbutrin - excellent augmentation strategy
>
> >Should I just stick with Nortryptiline and try it anyways since it's my best shot?
>
> I think Wellbutrin is a better choice.
>
> Eric
> - Abilify
>
>Thanks a lot for your feedback! I figure then wellbutrin or Nortryptiline it is. Do you have any comment on using Lithium since it increases SERT effect and decreases NE? Would this knock me out 24/7? I would be thinking of taking a REALLY low dose since I'm not bi-polar.
And do you have any idea why I'm freezing cold still? I developed it at 60 mg of Nardil and I'm still not normal yet (on day 9 of 0 mg. All other MAOI side effects are gone (constipation, urinary retention, memory is still a little wobbly probably because now I'm starting to feel irritated and depressed).
Posted by phidippus on October 28, 2012, at 22:48:08
In reply to Re: Help with my Nardil restart plan. LF drug opinions, posted by gilmourr on October 28, 2012, at 22:02:08
>Do you have any comment on using Lithium since it increases SERT effect and decreases NE? Would this knock me out 24/7? I would be thinking of taking a REALLY low dose since I'm not bi-polar.
At a low dose, the decrease in NE will be negligible. I'm at 1200 mg and don't have and never had any issues with my level of consciousness.
>And do you have any idea why I'm freezing cold still?
I thought they listed that as an SE of Nardil...
Eric
Posted by gilmourr on October 29, 2012, at 0:24:08
In reply to Re: Help with my Nardil restart plan. LF drug opinions » gilmourr, posted by phidippus on October 28, 2012, at 22:48:08
> >Do you have any comment on using Lithium since it increases SERT effect and decreases NE? Would this knock me out 24/7? I would be thinking of taking a REALLY low dose since I'm not bi-polar.
>
> At a low dose, the decrease in NE will be negligible. I'm at 1200 mg and don't have and never had any issues with my level of consciousness.
>
> >And do you have any idea why I'm freezing cold still?
>
> I thought they listed that as an SE of Nardil...
>
> Eric
Don't even think they do. Maybe in super rare circumstances. Either way, I've been off it for 9 days (starting today) and its not better yet. Also it was only from 60 mg and when I came down to 45 mg and waited for 30 days it didn't go away.
Where normally 45 mg presents no cold intolerance issues.
Posted by gilmourr on October 30, 2012, at 15:27:51
In reply to Re: Help with my Nardil restart plan. LF drug opinions, posted by gilmourr on October 29, 2012, at 0:24:08
SLS do you have any ideas with regards to this and what drug to add to Nardil?
This is the end of the thread.
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