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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by torrid on May 27, 2011, at 8:23:05
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?, posted by jono_in_adelaide on May 26, 2011, at 17:38:48
I can deal with the pain right now, 2 years of phyisical therapy and I'm doing prity good, my back is fairly stable now but my anxiety and depression (ADHD) is bad right now, took me by surprize, been years since I've been in this state.
Posted by torrid on May 27, 2011, at 8:38:46
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD? » torrid, posted by Phillipa on May 26, 2011, at 20:11:43
my doc wouldn't write the miltown it in stead he gave me klonipin, he avoids high risk drugs. My insurence covers miltown but not benzo's, that was the reason I was interested in it. I'll come out of this, I always have in the past. My back pain is a lot worse either from my mental state or from increasing my exersize. I'm trying everything possible to get out of this, amino acids, sun exposure, excersize, possitive social interactions. I hurt my back fishing of all things
Posted by Phillipa on May 27, 2011, at 19:47:17
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD? » Phillipa, posted by torrid on May 27, 2011, at 8:38:46
Torrid I don't understand why an insurance company would pay for miltown and not benzos. I always thought it much stronger than benzos? I did get the soma free on medicaire and it has the metabolite. Now really confused. Thanks for the info. I must try some searches? If you know anymore will you let me know? Phillipa
Posted by torrid on May 27, 2011, at 21:00:19
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD? » torrid, posted by Phillipa on May 27, 2011, at 19:47:17
I'm on medicare part d with extra help and they don;t cover benzo's, I would have to pay a large copay to cover them. I don't know what miltown is but it sounds like it may be a very good drug for anxiety, but out dated.
Posted by Phillipa on May 27, 2011, at 23:59:36
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?, posted by torrid on May 27, 2011, at 21:00:19
Torrid also have Medicaire and Part D and for a month of two benzos $19 for both they are not expensive and some meds on their formulary are free. Was getting luvox generic free and changed plans now $7.00 a month get the l00mg and split so lasts much longer. Same with benzos split them. My pdoc knows I don't abuse them so writes for higher doses than I take. Now you really have me curious about the miltown. As I think back I do believe it was the stronger of the meds. Soma is free. So now all meds expensive. I pay full price for the generic benzos but that's it $19.00/mth that's for valium and xanax regular Phillipa
Posted by torrid on May 28, 2011, at 23:08:09
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD? » torrid, posted by Phillipa on May 27, 2011, at 23:59:36
klonapin and temazapam are about 35 dollars a month, with the SAMe and other vitimins and all the copays it's a lot of money for me. The bad thing about miltown is that it's hard on the liver, or was it the kidneys? cymbalta is hard on the liver and I am concerned about liver issues, that's not something I want to go through again.
Posted by Phillipa on May 29, 2011, at 19:35:20
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD? » Phillipa, posted by torrid on May 28, 2011, at 23:08:09
I don't blame you at all. Didn't know miltown had liver issues. Glad I didn't know a thing about meds when on it. Thanks for the info also years later was on 60mg of cymbalta and didn't help anxiety. Just the benzos. Phillipa
Posted by torrid on May 31, 2011, at 9:23:03
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD? » torrid, posted by Phillipa on May 29, 2011, at 19:35:20
philpa, have you ever had luck with AD's for anxiety? I a reck right now, completely overwelmed. I had really good luck with lexapro, and paxil. It's one week on cymbalta and I expected to be OK by now. I'm expecting the death of a loved one, and my bereivement from a terrible loss 5 years ago has resurefaced, maybe I need to accept that for now I'm just not going to be OK.
Posted by Phillipa on May 31, 2011, at 21:27:45
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD? » Phillipa, posted by torrid on May 31, 2011, at 9:23:03
No always needed a benzo. I do feel so for you!! Phillipa
Posted by torrid on June 1, 2011, at 15:06:28
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD? » torrid, posted by Phillipa on May 31, 2011, at 21:27:45
Your sweet, actually I'm lucky medication almost always works for me, and works quickly. Poop out is always the problem 6-9 months is a typical time frame for med;s to poop out. benzo's and concerta are the only meds that don't poop out. It's a week now on cymbalta and my best frend says I've been good all this week. that's a typical amount of time it takes for me to respond to medication. Just weeks ago I was is the deep despare in the top 10 in my life, and this week I'm playing with the neighbor hood kids and going fishing and spending time with other human beings. I do have anxiety still be I'm out of depression. This was the second time I've been it true depression and I don't know how people with treatment resistant depression make it.
Posted by Phillipa on June 1, 2011, at 21:48:55
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD? » Phillipa, posted by torrid on June 1, 2011, at 15:06:28
Wow one week of cymbalta and you are better? What dose are you taking? So glad it's working for you. I must be tx resistant as l5 years now but thyroid doesn't help. Phillipa
Posted by torrid on June 1, 2011, at 23:16:34
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD? » torrid, posted by Phillipa on June 1, 2011, at 21:48:55
yes I feel so lucky. It's always this way with me. Zoloft was the 3rd time a medication failed, it's tyipicaly 3-5 days that I snap out of it. I still have anxiety but anxiety and depression is expendentally worse then anxiety alone. The other side is how quick meds poop out, around 3 months they are only half as effective and 9-12 months I might relaps. I'm avoiding a very important time sensitive matter until I feel more stable. I'm a happy osterage with my head buried in the cool sand. I'm scared I will not be able to face this important matter coming in september. I've got to convince my doc to keep me in klonapin and up my concerta. I'm having fictional anxiety now, worried about side effects, worried I'm going to start sleep walking, useless worries to focus on rather then deal with the matter. My therapist qoutes, forget his name but he says "my life has been filled with catastrophes most of wich have never happened". Is that suppose to be funny? I don't know if I want laugh at my self right now.
Posted by desolationrower on June 5, 2011, at 16:43:53
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?, posted by torrid on May 27, 2011, at 8:11:39
Both dopamine and norepinephrine are involved in ADHD. They have somewhat different effects, and it is further complicated by the fact that they interact with each other's receptors, and in the cerebrum dopamine is reuptaken by noradrenergic reuptake pumps (DA reuptake pumps being rare, or non existant there.)
-d/r
Posted by torrid on June 5, 2011, at 19:19:27
In reply to doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y, posted by desolationrower on June 5, 2011, at 16:43:53
are you saying that reuptake of dopamine and norepiephine occurs by the same pathway?
Posted by desolationrower on June 11, 2011, at 13:27:25
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y » desolationrower, posted by torrid on June 5, 2011, at 19:19:27
> are you saying that reuptake of dopamine and norepiephine occurs by the same pathway?
in the pre-frontal cortex, yes. I don't think much occurs in location where there is significant about of dopamine reuptake pumps.
-d/r
Posted by desolationrower on June 11, 2011, at 13:28:37
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y, posted by desolationrower on June 11, 2011, at 13:27:25
This is probably the main reason attomoxatine, desipramine, etc help ADHD more than alpha2 agonists.
-d/r
Posted by torrid on June 11, 2011, at 18:54:23
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y » desolationrower, posted by torrid on June 5, 2011, at 19:19:27
I wondering why SAMe works so well for me. Wellbutrin was the best I've ever been till it pooped out. There is something about SAMe that is very much like Wellbutrin for me and I'm trying to figure it out. SAMe works on all three Seritonin, Norepiephin ,Dopamine and wellbutrin on Dopamine. Is it dopamine that works so well on me or Norepiephrine or both? Strattea is an NRI and that got me thinking, Dopamine is converted into Norepiephrin so it could be Norepiephine that my brain is in need of? I don't understand all this stuff like all of you and I'm using amino acids to try and help myself. Concerta is great but the rebound is hell. Wellbutrin was better then even the concerta, I'm looking for the common thread between concerta, SAMe and wellbutrin.
Posted by desolationrower on June 11, 2011, at 20:40:41
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y » torrid, posted by torrid on June 11, 2011, at 18:54:23
> I wondering why SAMe works so well for me. Wellbutrin was the best I've ever been till it pooped out. There is something about SAMe that is very much like Wellbutrin for me and I'm trying to figure it out. SAMe works on all three Seritonin, Norepiephin ,Dopamine and wellbutrin on Dopamine. Is it dopamine that works so well on me or Norepiephrine or both? Strattea is an NRI and that got me thinking, Dopamine is converted into Norepiephrin so it could be Norepiephine that my brain is in need of? I don't understand all this stuff like all of you and I'm using amino acids to try and help myself. Concerta is great but the rebound is hell. Wellbutrin was better then even the concerta, I'm looking for the common thread between concerta, SAMe and wellbutrin.
SAMe does a lot of stuff, related to methylation. If it works well, i'd just take it.
you may be able to reduce need by supplementing creatine.
-d/r
Posted by Conundrum on June 12, 2011, at 11:28:15
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y, posted by desolationrower on June 11, 2011, at 13:28:37
> This is probably the main reason attomoxatine, desipramine, etc help ADHD more than alpha2 agonists.
>
> -d/rAlso a NE reuptake inhibitor increases norepinephrine and epinephrine to all adrenergic receptors and subtypes, so alpha 1, beta 1, beta 2 and their subtypes. An alpha 2 agonist decreases the norepinephrine release in teh short term and only really helps increase transmission with the alpha 2 receptor.
Posted by torrid on June 12, 2011, at 13:08:20
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y » desolationrower, posted by Conundrum on June 12, 2011, at 11:28:15
I'm figured out that there are more then one recepter sites for nuerotransmitters, and I figured meds work by antagonist or agonist. but I can't keep up with the rest of it with out a textbook and a stonger pair of reading glasses. Is busbar an alpa2 agonist? Is attomoxatine stattera? strattera is a NRI wich started this train of thought.
Posted by torrid on June 12, 2011, at 13:16:02
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y » desolationrower, posted by Conundrum on June 12, 2011, at 11:28:15
transmission of alpha2 recepter what happens at the site? is it any thing to do with dopamine's convertion to norepiephin?
Posted by Conundrum on June 12, 2011, at 14:00:42
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y » Conundrum, posted by torrid on June 12, 2011, at 13:16:02
> transmission of alpha2 recepter what happens at the site? is it any thing to do with dopamine's convertion to norepiephin?
Well an alpha 2 agonist imitates norepinephrine and works directly on the alpha 2 receptor. It can do so more or less potently than endogenous norepinephrine depending on the substance. Buspar is an alpha 2 antagonist. So it should cause a release of norepinephrine and dopamine. Any NRI will increase norepinephrine indirectly to all norepinephrine receptors as well as increase dopamine in the prefrontal cortex.
Posted by torrid on June 12, 2011, at 15:52:45
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y » torrid, posted by Conundrum on June 12, 2011, at 14:00:42
stimulants increase dopamine that much I know but isn't there a direct relationship between dopamine and norepiephine. what does wellbutrin do the relationship between dopamine and norepiephin. I know dopamine reuptake will be slower but I don't know where dopamine is converted into norepiephine, I assume it's after reuptake and I can only speculate that wellbutrin may increase the ratio of dopamine to norepiephine. my brain hurts now
Posted by torrid on June 12, 2011, at 15:59:11
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y, posted by torrid on June 12, 2011, at 15:52:45
> stimulants increase dopamine that much I know but isn't there a direct relationship between dopamine and norepiephine. what does wellbutrin do the relationship between dopamine and norepiephin. I know dopamine reuptake will be slower but I don't know where dopamine is converted into norepiephine, I assume it's after reuptake and I can only speculate that wellbutrin may increase the ratio of dopamine to norepiephine. my brain hurts now
conundrum
Posted by desolationrower on June 13, 2011, at 18:32:50
In reply to Re: doesn't norepinephrin have a lot to do with ADHD?Y, posted by torrid on June 12, 2011, at 15:52:45
> stimulants increase dopamine that much I know but isn't there a direct relationship between dopamine and norepiephine. what does wellbutrin do the relationship between dopamine and norepiephin. I know dopamine reuptake will be slower but I don't know where dopamine is converted into norepiephine, I assume it's after reuptake and I can only speculate that wellbutrin may increase the ratio of dopamine to norepiephine. my brain hurts now
wellbutrin blocks reuptake of both NE and DA. it also does some other stuff. i don't think any drugs affect conversion of catecholamines, other than indirectly.
-d/r
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