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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by gardenergirl on June 25, 2009, at 12:37:46
Gah! Ambien used to work really well for me at just 5 mg. I've recently upped it to 10 mg each night, and it's still not working. Pdoc switched me to trazodone 50-100 mg, which I started night before last. So far no real effects, though I suppose I might be dealing with withdrawal insomnia effects from the Ambien.
Gah! I just want to sleep at night. Is that too much to ask? Not sure if I've got some new secondary insomnia, or if I've developed tolerance to zolpidem or what. Honestly, I also wonder if I just got a bad batch of zolpidem.
Hopeful about trazodone, though.
gg
Posted by Phillipa on June 25, 2009, at 13:05:52
In reply to Zolpidem (Ambien) has quit working, posted by gardenergirl on June 25, 2009, at 12:37:46
GG does that mean lunesta also wouldn't work. I once knew and worked with a pdoc who took trazadone to sleep. A former babbler is now also taking it and says it works was thinking of it myself. Since the ambien is pseudo benzo right does that mean take both and wean off the ambien? Phillipa
Posted by yxibow on June 25, 2009, at 18:33:46
In reply to Re: Zolpidem (Ambien) has quit working » gardenergirl, posted by Phillipa on June 25, 2009, at 13:05:52
> GG does that mean lunesta also wouldn't work. I once knew and worked with a pdoc who took trazadone to sleep. A former babbler is now also taking it and says it works was thinking of it myself. Since the ambien is pseudo benzo right does that mean take both and wean off the ambien? Phillipa
As you said it is a "pseudo"-benzodiazepine so if one has been taking a fair dose of benzodiazepines there may be cross neuroplasticity tolerance at the GABA receptors.
Ambien only really worked "once" in my life as far as 'feeling' it... wow, intense... I think I mentioned this earlier.At one point it was barely effective at 20mg but that is because I have taken fairly substantial doses of benzodiazepines at different points in the past and present.
Lunesta I would rate the strongest of that group, but one might discover they have to pay extra for 4mg instead of 3mg if there is tolerance. Still, I would try it at 3mg.Yes there is a metallic taste, in plenty of people, but this varies, and does not usually last past the morning.
Sonata, if that's around, is really I think the weakest.
Still, especially Ambien (Lunesta is approved for more long term use), is really only its strongest for about a 7 day use, maybe several weeks. Its often used though only by PRN by people (medical workers included especially) who have to pull shifts and reset clocks.-- Jay
Posted by elanor roosevelt on June 26, 2009, at 0:45:27
In reply to Re: Zolpidem (Ambien) has quit working » Phillipa, posted by yxibow on June 25, 2009, at 18:33:46
i had success with ambien for over 10 years
then my insurance company upped to copay so i started generic ambien
ine brand was mediocre and one was worthless
now i am trying sonata 20mg and doing okay
Posted by floatingbridge on June 26, 2009, at 1:00:45
In reply to Re: Zolpidem (Ambien) has quit working » gardenergirl, posted by Phillipa on June 25, 2009, at 13:05:52
I failed ambien as they say, though, really, it rather failed me. So off to Sonata land I go. Works for me. Is it really weaker? how so?
tradzedon put and kept me asleep with steep price to pay in the morning. Does one get over the hangover affect?
Posted by Frustratedmama on June 27, 2009, at 8:00:56
In reply to Re: Zolpidem (Ambien) has quit working, posted by floatingbridge on June 26, 2009, at 1:00:45
Hangover effect went away for me ( try taking 1/2 dose for a week or so then increase). Also, now the lunesta seems to be losing effectiveness with gabapentin on board, strange huh? I have never tried remeron but some claim it is great for sleep!
Posted by yxibow on June 27, 2009, at 23:29:52
In reply to Re: Zolpidem (Ambien) has quit working, posted by Frustratedmama on June 27, 2009, at 8:00:56
> Hangover effect went away for me ( try taking 1/2 dose for a week or so then increase). Also, now the lunesta seems to be losing effectiveness with gabapentin on board, strange huh? I have never tried remeron but some claim it is great for sleep!
Well -- gabapentin does also work indirectly on GABA by being GABA itself with some molecules changed so it can actually enter the brain unlike GABA supplements which really are ineffective.
I wouldn't normally think it develops cross-pollination like benzodiazepines do with pseudo-benzodiazepines like Lunesta (Sonata, and Ambien) but anything could be possible.
Or you may be becoming used to the Lunesta all by itself, even though it has been thought to be capable of being used much longer than Ambien can.
Some people (insomniacs like myself) may require more than 3mg (which may not be reimbursed by insurance).
At this point though with a fair amount of benzodiazepines on board, none of those three do much of anything. But that's a personal experience.
Remeron is a good and unique tetracyclic antidepressant and has some properties that have been attributed to reshaping the REM sleep cycle.
It does carry the liability of weight increase really as I've experienced at any dose (some people claim that high doses dont do this, I think its just dose dependent rather on how strong the craving for food is and whatever the medication is doing itself.)
So watch for any signs of increased hunger, which can be very subtle.
-- Jay
Posted by Frustratedmama on June 28, 2009, at 7:58:12
In reply to Re: Zolpidem (Ambien) has quit working » Frustratedmama, posted by yxibow on June 27, 2009, at 23:29:52
Thanks Jay! I just increased the dose back to 2 mg ( I was going to 1 for a while with the verapamil) and it is working again . HURRAY!!!!!! Also, I am taking my last Gabapentin dose earlier now so as not to interfere with the lunesta..... This seems to help!
Posted by yxibow on June 28, 2009, at 16:00:26
In reply to Re: Zolpidem (Ambien) has quit working, posted by Frustratedmama on June 28, 2009, at 7:58:12
> Thanks Jay! I just increased the dose back to 2 mg ( I was going to 1 for a while with the verapamil) and it is working again . HURRAY!!!!!! Also, I am taking my last Gabapentin dose earlier now so as not to interfere with the lunesta..... This seems to help!
You're also taking Verapamil ?
Is it for high blood pressure or mood / other stabilization.
I am currently on a trial of it, and yes, I was told to reduce my Valium dosage (increases P450-3A4). Its hard to say what its doing to me at the moment, I'm on a low amount.
-- Jay
Posted by Frustratedmama on June 28, 2009, at 16:18:59
In reply to Re: Verapamil » Frustratedmama, posted by yxibow on June 28, 2009, at 16:00:26
Hi Jay
Actually I am off the verapamil now- it helped for about 2-3 weeks- then seemed to stop (this happened before to me). But this time the constipation was so bad and I gained weight very quickly so I ended up feeling "crappy" (literally and figuratively) and fat. Now just taking the gabapentin with adderall and at night taking the lunesta. (Verapamil was ok for a few weeks only for me)
Hope it is better for you!
FM
Posted by yxibow on June 28, 2009, at 23:18:21
In reply to Re: Verapamil, posted by Frustratedmama on June 28, 2009, at 16:18:59
> Hi Jay
> Actually I am off the verapamil now- it helped for about 2-3 weeks- then seemed to stop (this happened before to me). But this time the constipation was so bad and I gained weight very quickly so I ended up feeling "crappy" (literally and figuratively) and fat. Now just taking the gabapentin with adderall and at night taking the lunesta. (Verapamil was ok for a few weeks only for me)
> Hope it is better for you!
> FM
Curious on the weight gain - I believe its weight neutral but I suppose it can differ.Yes, my doctor mentioned the thing about "feeling crappy"... I had some odd headache and strange feeling but it went away.
I don't know if its doing anything but I'm still, unless I can tell if its really doing something worse, finishing up the trial, since I did ask for it and it was one of the more obscure things I hadn't tried yet.
It took some convincing to get an okay on it, I mean in rare occasions it can cause problems, as it is a heart medication.
We'll see.
-- Jay
Posted by Frustratedmama on June 29, 2009, at 11:35:51
In reply to Re: Verapamil » Frustratedmama, posted by yxibow on June 28, 2009, at 23:18:21
This is the end of the thread.
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