![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 16 of 16. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Cseagraves on May 21, 2009, at 19:20:57
Hi to all.
I need some help.
After being on a roller-coaster for so long, (years and years), I am beginning to think I might be bi-polar. A pdoc tried to dx me with this years ago, but I wouldn't accept it and I changed pdocs. My hubby has always thought that I might be, but I wouldn't listen to him either.
Am now willing to be able to accept it now, but how do you know if you are and how do you know which one?
Some help please.
Thanks,
Courtney
Posted by ricker on May 21, 2009, at 19:37:41
In reply to How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by Cseagraves on May 21, 2009, at 19:20:57
> Hi to all.
A pdoc tried to dx me with this years ago, but I wouldn't accept it and I changed pdocs.
Hi Courtney,I think your statement speaks volumes, I would be inclined to accept your ex p/docs dx.
Also, I have been seeing the same p/doc for 16 years, we have a great relationship and I have great confidence in his ability to treat me.
I've asked him numerous times for a diagnosis and his answer has remained the same, 5 p/docs may give 5 different dx's, all that matters is my response to the medication, and adjust accordingly.
I know through research, my meds are commonly prescribed for BP2, and also for BP1 as well as treatment resistant depression.
Maybe someone else can chime in on "how" to determine BP.
Take care, Rick
Posted by Phillipa on May 21, 2009, at 20:05:05
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are bi-polar? » Cseagraves, posted by ricker on May 21, 2009, at 19:37:41
Courtney can you list your symtoms and how you feel, how long they last, mood swings, and meds and combos? Phillipa
Posted by Cseagraves on May 21, 2009, at 20:23:43
In reply to How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by Cseagraves on May 21, 2009, at 19:20:57
I apologize, but I guess I need to give more info.
I have always had anger issues. Now that I am willing to sit back and listen to hubby and other family members, this is what they say.
I have always been extremely high (happy) or extremely low (anger more than depression), hardly ever even keeled. Family just learned to put up with me. Now over the past year and half anger has turned into extreme anxiety, fear, agoraphobia. My hubby says instead of as much anger now I am more hope (like when I start a new med) to despair and depressed (when med doesn't work.)
The first pdoc who dxd me with bi-polar gave me seroquel and just kept raising dosage on me. Could not tolerate it past 200 mgs without horrible side effects. It stopped the obsessive thinking but it never stopped anxiety. I am in what feels like constant fight or flight mode. Constant adrenaline pumping. Insomnia and nauseau are a constant, (although I take xanax for sleep).
Feel like I am on the outside looking in, not really a part of this world. Am always shaking. Feels like energy is there, but no motivation to do anything. This knot wells up in the pit of my stomach when I think of trying to clean house or work out. I have bad reactions to anti-depressants. Recently had awful experience with Zoloft and have tried others in the past (Paxil, Lexapro)no good. Never really considered myself depressed until the last six months or so because I have become more and more recluse.
Recently tried Nardil and over three weeks made me incredibly ill and never helped me to feel better at all. Made me start vomiting after third week.
Things are getting worse. Was just thinking I had extreme anxiety, but I can't go out of the house hardly at all. I want to, but I become so fearful because I feel so strange that I dont want to go anywhere. It feels like a chore to have to communicate with anyone outside the house.
Tried to go out to eat tonight and grocery store with husband. Just wanted to hurry up and eat and get out of there. When we went to the grocery store, was in panic the whole time and just wanted to get home. I dont feel apart of life.
Manage to get some things done around the house (laundry, dishes and barely taking care of my kids) but thats about it. Used to care about how I looked and dressed. I care, but my whole body and head tenses up at the thought of doing anything. My husband says I look like I am in total despair all the time, very pale and can tell the stress is taking its toll on my looks.
Seems what started out as extreme anxiety and panic 1 1/2 years ago has also pulled down into depression because I feel like I am losing everything.
Constant pressure (extreme tension) in head all the time until I take my meds to go to sleep which is 7.5 of remeron and 1.5 xanax. Only time I seem a little relaxed then and can manage to get some sleep, but it is never good sleep. Have tried to take these during the day but don't seem to do much.
Still have some seroquel in the cabinet and was thinking of taking that again until I get back into pdoc which won't be until next Wednesday.
Am falling deeper and deeper into despair now. Feel constant guilt about what I am doing to everyone else's life around me, especially by kids. Am losing weight like crazy, no appetite. Have to force down food. Might feel o.k. somedays but mostly I just feel awful because I feel like I am losing my life and my mind. So maybe I am bi-polar. Have no idea any more.
Thanks,
Courtney
Posted by floatingbridge on May 21, 2009, at 21:21:36
In reply to How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by Cseagraves on May 21, 2009, at 19:20:57
Dear Courtney,
Well so much of your symptoms mirror mine. Not the anger, so much, but the hope to utter despair and feeling at the mercy of emotions--would you say emotional lability? I'm also thinking of SP emerging along with a bipolar diagnosis. (Oh, and the debilitating anxiety!) I was diagnosed recently along what is now popularly called a bipolar spectrum. I think some docs might diagnosis me a bipolar II. My pdoc,, who I like, diagnosed me as bipolar nos (not other-wise specified). I am also considered ultra rapid cycling. He believes, though, as someone mentioned in an above post (I'm sorry I forgot who :) ) that what matters is response to treatment. Once I embraced my diagnosis, it explained alot for alot of years. I also treat my label /diagnosis as just that--a name for something no one is quite sure what it is.
A question for you that every doc asks: Does it run in your family in any form that you can see?
Also Courtney, is the diagnosis at all 'helpful' to you? Does it explain anything for you?
I'll be fifty this year, My depressions weren't spelled out in capitals until about forty. I think age can have something to do with it for some people. What, I don't know.
Keep on keeping on!
Candace
Posted by ricker on May 21, 2009, at 21:50:47
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by Cseagraves on May 21, 2009, at 20:23:43
Have you tried lamictal, has some A/D properties and sounds like you could use some mood stabilization. Maybe clonazepam for anxiety and it will help with A/D start-up side-effects as well. Pristiq, have you tried it given your ssri failure? Just some options.
Hope you feel well soon.
Take care, Rick
Posted by Phillipa on May 21, 2009, at 21:51:23
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by floatingbridge on May 21, 2009, at 21:21:36
Well 63 here so older. Panic attacks age 24 benzos functioned well til menopause school raising kids, own business, then thyroid went and everything went downhill. Not agoraphobia but phone phobia, fears of going upstairs (yes I'm aware all the fears are ridiculous but still there). Now the benzos are doing nothing, and stay on tiniest dose of luvox for many years. Sleep late at night til late in am. So how do you distinguish fear anxiety from bipolar? Phillipa
Posted by Justherself54 on May 21, 2009, at 23:13:14
In reply to How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by Cseagraves on May 21, 2009, at 19:20:57
Your family said you are either really up or really down..can you describe how you felt the last time you felt really, really good, and did you display any out of the ordinary behaviour when you felt like that..
When I was in a pretty manic state, I displayed behaviour that was totally out of character..
Also, I had been seeing one pdoc for close to 20 years and he never mentioned bipolar..just treated me for episodes of depression during those years..the pdoc I see now is the one who diagnosed me with BP..and when I look at my past, I definitely can see manic episodes..and I was very producive through some of them (I'd jump in where fools fear to tread") career wise!
I kid around and say I gotta watch out for the 3 S's..changes in sex, sleep and shopping
I also can relate to the anger issues..some meds can seriously ramp up my temper..and along with that I can be extemely sensitive to critcism..
Some of what you're describing also sounds like severe anxiety/panic disorder. I've been agoraphobic before also (I'd like to know who's damn genes I inherited)!
Sorry, but I'm starting to ramble..hopefully some others will chime in..hang in there.
Posted by greywolf on May 21, 2009, at 23:45:43
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by Cseagraves on May 21, 2009, at 20:23:43
Courtney:
Your symptoms don't really describe very clearly either manic or hypomanic episodes. What I read into what you wrote is a depressive disorder with some type of anxiety aspect.
I wouldn't encourage a doc to dx BP under the circumstances you describe. Major depressive disorder, probably. GAD probably. BP doubtful. You want to make sure that you're not wrongly dx'd as BP so that you don't go through med regimes that just aren't going to work for you.
Greywolf
Posted by Zana on May 22, 2009, at 15:15:19
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by greywolf on May 21, 2009, at 23:45:43
I am not bipolar. Have never had anything like a manic episode unless you count buying lipstick, eyeline and eyeshade base on-line. But because my father and brother display some mood instability and because SSRIs pooped out on me, my former pdoc started trying mood stabilizing meds. None of them were of any help to me at all. Neither did the Aytipical Antipsychotics...some where a little help for a while.
I would agree with the previous poster (sorry I forgot your name) that it sounds as if you are describing a major depressive episode. At least the kind of symptoms I experienced.
Some ideas: You could be taking a lot more remeron. Its considered a really good AD, a great sleeper and I for one have not had any weight gain on it. Not your problem right now. I am taking 45mgs. Combined with Pristiq, a combination dubbed California Jet Fuel (I think) The combination has helped though the remeron alone did nothing for my depression. I also take Provigil. It really gets me over that stuck, blocked feeling, over the hump. I am much more likely just to do something than to perseverate about what to do. I also take klonopin, 3mgs daily in divided doses. I have it in mind that it would be better to take less but since I am feeling pretty good most of the time, I am not inclined to mess with things.
I think you need to find something that is going to address the depression directly and that when you do, some of your symptoms will disappear and the picture will be clearer.
Sounds like a really bad place to be right now. Good luck with the pdoc. I also agree that the diagnosis is not as important as your response to medications.Zana
Posted by polarbear206 on May 22, 2009, at 15:45:51
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by Cseagraves on May 21, 2009, at 20:23:43
> I apologize, but I guess I need to give more info.
>
> I have always had anger issues. Now that I am willing to sit back and listen to hubby and other family members, this is what they say.
>
> I have always been extremely high (happy) or extremely low (anger more than depression), hardly ever even keeled. Family just learned to put up with me. Now over the past year and half anger has turned into extreme anxiety, fear, agoraphobia. My hubby says instead of as much anger now I am more hope (like when I start a new med) to despair and depressed (when med doesn't work.)
>
> The first pdoc who dxd me with bi-polar gave me seroquel and just kept raising dosage on me. Could not tolerate it past 200 mgs without horrible side effects. It stopped the obsessive thinking but it never stopped anxiety. I am in what feels like constant fight or flight mode. Constant adrenaline pumping. Insomnia and nauseau are a constant, (although I take xanax for sleep).
>
> Feel like I am on the outside looking in, not really a part of this world. Am always shaking. Feels like energy is there, but no motivation to do anything. This knot wells up in the pit of my stomach when I think of trying to clean house or work out. I have bad reactions to anti-depressants. Recently had awful experience with Zoloft and have tried others in the past (Paxil, Lexapro)no good. Never really considered myself depressed until the last six months or so because I have become more and more recluse.
>
> Recently tried Nardil and over three weeks made me incredibly ill and never helped me to feel better at all. Made me start vomiting after third week.
>
> Things are getting worse. Was just thinking I had extreme anxiety, but I can't go out of the house hardly at all. I want to, but I become so fearful because I feel so strange that I dont want to go anywhere. It feels like a chore to have to communicate with anyone outside the house.
>
> Tried to go out to eat tonight and grocery store with husband. Just wanted to hurry up and eat and get out of there. When we went to the grocery store, was in panic the whole time and just wanted to get home. I dont feel apart of life.
>
> Manage to get some things done around the house (laundry, dishes and barely taking care of my kids) but thats about it. Used to care about how I looked and dressed. I care, but my whole body and head tenses up at the thought of doing anything. My husband says I look like I am in total despair all the time, very pale and can tell the stress is taking its toll on my looks.
>
> Seems what started out as extreme anxiety and panic 1 1/2 years ago has also pulled down into depression because I feel like I am losing everything.
>
> Constant pressure (extreme tension) in head all the time until I take my meds to go to sleep which is 7.5 of remeron and 1.5 xanax. Only time I seem a little relaxed then and can manage to get some sleep, but it is never good sleep. Have tried to take these during the day but don't seem to do much.
>
> Still have some seroquel in the cabinet and was thinking of taking that again until I get back into pdoc which won't be until next Wednesday.
>
> Am falling deeper and deeper into despair now. Feel constant guilt about what I am doing to everyone else's life around me, especially by kids. Am losing weight like crazy, no appetite. Have to force down food. Might feel o.k. somedays but mostly I just feel awful because I feel like I am losing my life and my mind. So maybe I am bi-polar. Have no idea any more.
>
> Thanks,
> Courtney
>
>
Courtney,Please go to psycheducation.org for some education on bipolar spectrum. There are many red flags in your post that are indicative of an underlying bipolar depression. AD's without a mood stablizer will exacerbate your depression, anxiety, anger, etc... Keep a mood log. This an important tool to assit you and your doctor. Hope this helps.
Posted by floatingbridge on May 22, 2009, at 17:36:33
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by Phillipa on May 21, 2009, at 21:51:23
> Well 63 here so older. Panic attacks age 24 benzos functioned well til menopause school raising kids, own business, then thyroid went and everything went downhill. Not agoraphobia but phone phobia, fears of going upstairs (yes I'm aware all the fears are ridiculous but still there). Now the benzos are doing nothing, and stay on tiniest dose of luvox for many years. Sleep late at night til late in am. So how do you distinguish fear anxiety from bipolar? Phillipa
Hi Phillipa,
That's a good question for me since anxiety, SP and depression are now major issues for me. I cannot address the question nearly as well as some here, and anyone who suffers from anxiety knows that the effects on mind and body are profound and that it exacerbates almost every condition.
I've had strong mood and drive changes since late adolesnce unrelated to anxiety. Now I have the anxiety, et al on top of it. Also, family members have bipolar, though my case is milder than most in family. There can also be a quality or 'pressure' to the changes that I can't quite describe....
Benzo burnout is my latest boogie man. Imperfect as it is, klonopin helps keep me functioning. Sounds like, given your full life, you've managed well.
Best,
Candace
Posted by ricker on May 22, 2009, at 18:44:51
In reply to How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by Cseagraves on May 21, 2009, at 19:20:57
Courtney, I just wanted to add that prior to the internet era...late 80', most patients were prescribed meds with little, or no understanding of there intentional use. Unless you went to the library and looked through a ton of books, you would take the med and hope for the best. Today, many of us have the luxury of researching there potential use, side-effects and opinions/reviews of pretty much any med,or combo there of, via sites like this or revolutionary health etc.
By reading posters reactions to a certain med and what they have been diagnosed with can be helpful for many as well as a roadblock for some.
Labeling oneself with a certain diagnosis still leaves the door wide open as each diagnosis can vary.... BP2, well some may cycle every 2 months, some every 2 weeks and some every 2 hours (ultradian). You can see that having a p/doc with a sound understanding of your "symptoms" is crucial.
Heck, depression itself has so many variants that may require unique treatments. I'm not saying one should be ignorant as to a diagnosis, rather, knowing that your p/doc fully understands your symptoms, response to a certain drug or group of drugs, is most crucial. Some BP1'S require A/D's and to others it's their poison, a finding usually through trial and error.
So that's my take on the whole "what are you diagnosed with" dilemma.
Treat the symptoms and hope for the best, it doesn't matter if you're taking a med commonly prescribed for a certain group.My major complaint is depression with anxiety and find A/P'S provide some relief. I've never been diagnose as "psychotic", but they work! :-)
Hope you feel well soon..... Rick
Posted by Zyprexa on May 22, 2009, at 23:31:34
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by Cseagraves on May 21, 2009, at 20:23:43
In stead of seroquel I think you should try zyprexa. Its good for anger issues and anxiety. Sounds like seroquel is not working for you. You sound like you could be bi-polar, maybe a little something else mixed in, not sure what, but maybe PTSD? I don't know.
Posted by Elanor Roosevelt on May 25, 2009, at 19:47:42
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by floatingbridge on May 21, 2009, at 21:21:36
-would you say emotional lability?
I love this phrase "emotional liability."
Posted by Phillipa on May 25, 2009, at 21:12:16
In reply to Re: How do you know if you are bi-polar?, posted by Elanor Roosevelt on May 25, 2009, at 19:47:42
Eleanor almost sounds like a dance. Phillipa
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.