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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 12 of 12. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by AdamCanada2 on January 1, 2009, at 21:39:43
I know this may seem a little long put please read or skim over it. My symptoms at the bottom of page. It took me 3 days to be able to finally feel like I can write this.
I been off Parnate (which I tried various doses of) for about 5 days now. The lowest which was 5mg before completely going off it. Highest being 40mg which would be too much and make me want to sleep all the time. 10mg seemed best out of the 20mg 30mg 40mg etc. I am very sensitive to meds usually.
Now... since I been on just tiny bit ativan until I am able to get valium tomorrow and yesterday tiny bit of ritalin that I stopped and see how I am without it, a closer baseline... I am able to see in hindsight that 10mg parnate did in fact help my dep and social anxiety. Here is what it did overall...
Parnate, the good and bad:
Good:
- Searing head pains gone!
- Productive (feel like real reasons to get up from bed)
- Enhanced energy
- Often stimulating effect
- Extreme Anhedonia diminished to some degree. More able to enjoy, and have interest.
- Helps for Depression to a degree.- Works well with coffee
- Ritalin effect enhanced at low dose parnateBad:
- Worsening evenings (Evenings would get tiring, depressing, even terrible very often)
- Severe insomnia and sleep exhaustion.- Not as social as I was on paxil
- Low sex driveI was on parnate 10mg + valium for about 3-4 weeks and it was not bad compared to how i feel now which is terrible. Added in little bit of ritalin (but i have tolerance to it) during final week and it felt like I had one of the best weeks in a longgggg time.
Now without it, and without any paxil, and without the 20+ meds that I tried which did little/nothing or worsened dep.
My symptoms are:
-Tiredness
-Harsh often burning head pains
-Extreme Anhedonia
-Non-social, not talkative
-Lacking emotion
-Difficulty thinking/concentrating
-Apathy, feel like a zombie
-Only feel minimal pleasure and motivationWould nardil be a good option? Pls dont mention any SSRI's or wellbutrin. I tried those unless some new SSRI's are out but I doubt I can afford them.
Worst case scenario at least I can feel something better than 'horrible' if I go back on Paxil 10mg or Parnate 10ish mg.
My doctor refuses to prescribe me a proper sleep aid such as ambien/lunesta though. So I dont know but being on parnate even with 6 hours or less sleep a day was quite better than how I feel now.
Please offer any advice.
Posted by Justherself54 on January 1, 2009, at 22:00:19
In reply to Need urgent advice PLS. Almost at my baseline dep., posted by AdamCanada2 on January 1, 2009, at 21:39:43
I had very bad insomnia on Nardil and had to double my normal sleep meds. It is a great med..unfortunately I had problems with side effects, but that's just me.
Posted by Phillipa on January 1, 2009, at 23:36:20
In reply to Need urgent advice PLS. Almost at my baseline dep., posted by AdamCanada2 on January 1, 2009, at 21:39:43
Adam paxil is an SSRI. Sounds like it worked. Why did you change to an MAOI? Could you take a higher dose of paxil? You sound torn between the two meds. Love Phillipa
Posted by Sigismund on January 2, 2009, at 0:52:26
In reply to Need urgent advice PLS. Almost at my baseline dep., posted by AdamCanada2 on January 1, 2009, at 21:39:43
Parnate gives almost everyone insomnia.
Nardil might be an OK option if you had a sleep aid and you were OK with the sex problems.
I didn't mind 10mg Parnate either, though when I increased it things became freaky.
I wonder what those searing head pains are caused by?
>-Tiredness
-Harsh often burning head pains
-Extreme Anhedonia
-Non-social, not talkative
-Lacking emotion
-Difficulty thinking/concentrating
-Apathy, feel like a zombie
-Only feel minimal pleasure and motivationThis is familiar.
Have you tried tianeptine or Trivastal?
Since your depression/whatever was kicked off by Accutane (was it?) might it be a good idea for you to take fish oil?
Posted by jedi on January 2, 2009, at 1:56:02
In reply to Need urgent advice PLS. Almost at my baseline dep., posted by AdamCanada2 on January 1, 2009, at 21:39:43
If my doctor refused to give a sleep aid with a MAOI, I would be searching for a new doctor. Very few people can take Parnate or Nardil without something to help them sleep. It is very difficult to recover from depression without proper sleep. I've been on Nardil for most of eleven years now. I used trazodone at first for sleep. Currently I take 25mg of Seroquel, which knocks me right out with no need to escalate the dosage.
Be Well,
Jedi
Posted by AdamCanada2 on January 2, 2009, at 11:59:29
In reply to Re: Need urgent advice PLS. Almost at my baseline dep., posted by Sigismund on January 2, 2009, at 0:52:26
I attempted to order tianeptine but it could not get through customs.
I wish I could try it and already discussed it with my doctor several times. Just a matter of getting it but whatever. We don't even have medications like Abilify approved here in Canada yet. It's pathetic.
I also tried Trivistal LA with paxil around 1 year ago. It seemed to make me progressively worse and tired.
Posted by AdamCanada2 on January 2, 2009, at 12:02:22
In reply to Re: Need urgent advice PLS. Almost at my baseline dep. » AdamCanada2, posted by jedi on January 2, 2009, at 1:56:02
my doc is still one of the best I have ever found. Out of the several doctors that I have gone through he actually listens to what I have to say despite our disagreements on certian things.
If he can give me a proper sleep aid instead of zipicone or whatever it's called then maybe this Parnate could be really promising.
> If my doctor refused to give a sleep aid with a MAOI, I would be searching for a new doctor. Very few people can take Parnate or Nardil without something to help them sleep. It is very difficult to recover from depression without proper sleep. I've been on Nardil for most of eleven years now. I used trazodone at first for sleep. Currently I take 25mg of Seroquel, which knocks me right out with no need to escalate the dosage.
> Be Well,
> Jedi
>
Posted by AdamCanada2 on January 2, 2009, at 12:09:59
In reply to Re: Need urgent advice PLS. Almost at my baseline dep. » AdamCanada2, posted by Phillipa on January 1, 2009, at 23:36:20
Yes it worked to a degree but despite various doses attempted the 10mg paxil was the balance that prevented me from feeling like sleeping all the time. There was a period of time where 8mg paxil seemed to be best but eventually my depression became much worse. Coincidence? It got worse during winter. I dont know what caused it. This was 1 year ago though.
Paxil helps but it requires ritalin to allow me to be social enough with individuals. Not to mention the combination kept me less depressed but this was nothing close to remission.
Plus ritalin would develop tolerance over time.
> Adam paxil is an SSRI. Sounds like it worked. Why did you change to an MAOI? Could you take a higher dose of paxil? You sound torn between the two meds. Love Phillipa
Posted by JadeKelly on January 2, 2009, at 20:21:28
In reply to Re: Need urgent advice PLS. Almost at my baseline dep. » Phillipa, posted by AdamCanada2 on January 2, 2009, at 12:09:59
Hello,
My advice, considering you're "good" list is to stay on 10mg Parnate, get to GP if allowed and get sleep aid (thats rediculous your PDOC won't give you one!) I'm assuming all advice given for sleep aids is lost on the fact that doc won't prescribe. I'm on 60mg Parnate and take 6mg melatonin for sleep. If you are sensitive? maybe try 3mg 1st. Also, improves mood. Get the 3mg with stress reducer (run contradictions by pharmacy). Take 3mg in evening if you don't have to do anything, maybe another at bedtime. If your med sensitive, you won't be disappointed!
~jade
Posted by greenmtn on January 8, 2009, at 0:47:43
In reply to Re: Need urgent advice PLS. Almost at my baseline dep. » AdamCanada2, posted by JadeKelly on January 2, 2009, at 20:21:28
Just a suggestion on insomnia treatment for MAOI's. I have been on Emsam 9 (MG)for about 2 years. It has been a wonder drug for me for deep depression. BIG problem is insomnia! I tried LOTS of meds for insomnia. Only trazadone worked but made me feel like crap. So for a long time I've been surviving on 3 or 4 hrs sleep. And then a daytime crash of overwhelming sleepiness.
Now I have found a Very effective treatment for me for insomnia specifically neurontin. I'm very sensitive to it and high doses make me very loopy and uncoordinated. I now take 125 mg in the evening and am able to sleep a good 7 hours. I Have been taking this for 2 weeks and have not told my PDOC about it.My other meds are:
150 mg Lamictal
2 mg clonazapam
(perhaps clonazapam adds to its effect)
Posted by Sissy35 on January 8, 2009, at 12:43:30
In reply to Need urgent advice PLS. Almost at my baseline dep., posted by AdamCanada2 on January 1, 2009, at 21:39:43
I took nardil for about 20yrs and it stopped working more than 5yrs ago. I have tried everything and could find nothing to replace it. I am also extremely sensitive to meds. All kinds any kind. Plus I had to be on the lowest dose.
If it hadn't been for this board I would have quit Parnate after 2 days like always.
My start up symtoms were the same as yours. I lost interest in everything!!! Didnt want the phone to ring or hear a knock at the door.
I didn't feel quite as depressed but this feeling is not much better. Now what?
After about a month and a dosage of 40mg. I am not dead inside anymore. I had such migraines that I would lose my vision (but I have MS and going blind is normal for me)
For me the evenings were the worst. I would sit here scared to death. That has passed also as I increased the dose which I would never do before.
Try to accept the way you feel and take it slow. Thats the only way I am getting through this start up crap. nardil takes just as long or longer and had worse side effects than Parnate for me. Sex life was a big laugh.
Acceptance can help in many waysSissy35
Posted by Sissy35 on January 8, 2009, at 12:50:11
In reply to Re: Need urgent advice PLS. Almost at my baseline dep., posted by greenmtn on January 8, 2009, at 0:47:43
Loopy is a good word for neurontin. The first time I took it my father found me on the terrece playing with ants. He thaught I was drunk. I felt like it too. Acually really enjoyed it because I have never been drunk in my life.
sissy35
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