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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 11 of 11. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by capricorn on July 26, 2006, at 4:38:29
Posted by JahL on July 26, 2006, at 13:23:55
In reply to New NICE guidelines on bipolar (UK), posted by capricorn on July 26, 2006, at 4:38:29
> http://www.nice.org.uk/page.aspx?o=346153
The laptop I'm borrowing doesn't like PDF files, but I imagine their guidelines are typically cautious, with an over-emphasis on psychotherapy.
Anyway, I just wanted to point out to anyone that's at all interested, that NICE is a national disgrace. NICE is effectively a rationing body. Set up ostensibly to evaluate new medications, it really follows a cost-cutting agenda. It's a bunch of Labour-lackey, bean-counting quangocrats whose seemingly arbitrary decisions cause immense pain and suffering.
An excellent example of this is a story in today's Mail:
"Bone cancer victims in England will not be given a life-prolonging drug - although it is available to patients in Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland.
The drug, Velcade, which can put the cancer into remission and dramatically improve life expectancy, ***is also available in every other developed country in the world***.
But yesterday the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence refused to approve Velcade for use in England on the NHS, saying it is not 'cost-effective'. "
Perhaps more relevant to this board is NICE's disgraceful decision to withdraw cheap and effective drugs for Alzheimers sufferers on the grounds of cost:"Thousands of Alzheimer's sufferers will be denied drugs which cost as little as £2.50 a day.
The National Institute for Clinical Excellence (NICE) has ruled that Aricept, Exelon and Reminyl can only justifiably be given to those with moderate Alzheimer's. ***It will be denied to those in the early and later stages of the disease***. "
Few in the UK would disagree that our elderly are treated appallingly and this is further, damning evidence.Clinical excellence? Yeah right.
NICE isn't nice.
Cheers,
J.
Posted by capricorn on July 26, 2006, at 13:40:41
In reply to NICE isn't nice., posted by JahL on July 26, 2006, at 13:23:55
Whilst i agree with you concerning the alzheimer's drugs,it is a seperate issue.
Posted by Tom Twilight on July 26, 2006, at 15:02:53
In reply to New NICE guidelines on bipolar (UK), posted by capricorn on July 26, 2006, at 4:38:29
Jah is right
I'm not a big fan of NICE
Its aproach is typical of the kind of "one size fits all" thinking that seems to dominate NHS mental health care
Still if its drawing attention to Bipolar I guess thats good............
Posted by Phillipa on July 26, 2006, at 22:51:17
In reply to Re: New NICE guidelines on bipolar (UK), posted by Tom Twilight on July 26, 2006, at 15:02:53
My ignorance is showing again what is NICE? Thanks Love Phillipa
Posted by capricorn on July 27, 2006, at 3:12:22
In reply to Re: New NICE guidelines on bipolar (UK) » Tom Twilight, posted by Phillipa on July 26, 2006, at 22:51:17
> My ignorance is showing again what is NICE? Thanks Love Phillipa
National institute for clinical excellence
Posted by greywolf on July 27, 2006, at 11:54:03
In reply to Re: New NICE guidelines on bipolar (UK), posted by capricorn on July 27, 2006, at 3:12:22
The NICE standards appear to be more restrictive in terms of who qualifies for the BP diagnosis. For instance, the standards require the manic stage to last between 2 weeks and 4 months. That is substantially longer than the doctors I've talked to would require in order to make the dx.Is this an organization that advocates more limited patient access to medications?
Posted by capricorn on July 27, 2006, at 12:15:03
In reply to Re: New NICE guidelines on bipolar (UK), posted by greywolf on July 27, 2006, at 11:54:03
>
> The NICE standards appear to be more restrictive in terms of who qualifies for the BP diagnosis. For instance, the standards require the manic stage to last between 2 weeks and 4 months. That is substantially longer than the doctors I've talked to would require in order to make the dx.
>
> Is this an organization that advocates more limited patient access to medications?Let's just say they have a tendency to know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.
Posted by Phillipa on July 27, 2006, at 21:03:44
In reply to Re: New NICE guidelines on bipolar (UK), posted by capricorn on July 27, 2006, at 3:11:45
Thank-you capricorn. Love Phillipa
Posted by ed_uk on July 29, 2006, at 20:19:59
In reply to Re: New NICE guidelines on bipolar (UK), posted by greywolf on July 27, 2006, at 11:54:03
Hello,
>Is this an organization that advocates more limited patient access to medications?
NICE is a UK government organisation which produces many guidelines stating how various diseases should be treated. NICE may advise doctors which drugs should not be provided by the National Health Service (NHS). Although NHS doctors *can* legally prescribe drugs which are not recommended by NICE, they are likely to get a slapped wrist if they do. Doctors may prescribe drugs which are not recommended by NICE on a 'private prescription' - meaning that the patient will have to pay the full cost of the medication plus the pharmacy's fees, rather than simply paying the £6.65 NHS prescription charge.
Regards
Ed
Posted by greywolf on July 29, 2006, at 20:35:35
In reply to Re: New NICE guidelines on bipolar (UK) » greywolf, posted by ed_uk on July 29, 2006, at 20:19:59
> Hello,
>
> >Is this an organization that advocates more limited patient access to medications?
>
> NICE is a UK government organisation which produces many guidelines stating how various diseases should be treated. NICE may advise doctors which drugs should not be provided by the National Health Service (NHS). Although NHS doctors *can* legally prescribe drugs which are not recommended by NICE, they are likely to get a slapped wrist if they do. Doctors may prescribe drugs which are not recommended by NICE on a 'private prescription' - meaning that the patient will have to pay the full cost of the medication plus the pharmacy's fees, rather than simply paying the £6.65 NHS prescription charge.
>
> Regards
>
> EdThanks, Ed.
Sounds like NICE has an economic incentive to promote more restrictive diagnostic criteria whether or not they are accurate.
This is the end of the thread.
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