![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 8 of 8. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by Jen2 on January 26, 2005, at 16:58:09
Hi all,
I must say, now that I'm on Effexor, I have never been so without motivation in my life. I'm a graduate student and am having so much trouble getting things done. I guess the anxiety/stress that I used to feel was a motivator to get my work done. Now that it's largely gone, I really don't seem to care. I spend most of my time (when I'm not in class) checking my email or checking these boards, or doing some paid work that I can do from home. ARRGH!
I've seen from other posts that motivation can be a problem on Effexor. How does everyone cope with this? Do you have jobs that you have to be at? And, if so, how do you get your job done? Are there other students out there who are having similar problems? What are you doing about it? Does the motivation problem get better with time / increased dosage?
How can I fight my anxiety/depression and not crap out on the rest of my life at the same time?
And how do others deal with the other side effects (if you have any - like nausea, headaches, etc.) while holding down a job / doing school / minding children / generally keeping control over your life?
Thanks for any advice,
Jen
Posted by Iansf on January 26, 2005, at 20:06:51
In reply to What does everyone do all day long?, posted by Jen2 on January 26, 2005, at 16:58:09
> Hi all,
>
> I must say, now that I'm on Effexor, I have never been so without motivation in my life. I'm a graduate student and am having so much trouble getting things done. I guess the anxiety/stress that I used to feel was a motivator to get my work done. Now that it's largely gone, I really don't seem to care. I spend most of my time (when I'm not in class) checking my email or checking these boards, or doing some paid work that I can do from home. ARRGH!
>
>
I think you've hit on a general problem and one reason so many people say antidepressants make them apathetic. If you're used to using anxiety (along with the attendant guilt, worry, shame, etc.) as a motivator, once it's gone you don't a replacement to motivate you. After all, one of the things you've no doubt been striving for through everything you've done is contentment. You just didn't know how to get it. I'm sure there's been a fair amount of wasted energy put into things you thought would make you happy that never did.So if, thanks to a medication, you're now content, what's to strive for? Well, one thing is simply the enjoyment of doing. After you sit around feeling content for awhile and get comfortable with the idea the contentment isn't going to disapear, I think you'll discover the things you actually LIKE to do. And liking to do them will become the motivation for doing them. You'll also find you're more willing to do some things you don't like to do because doing them makes it possible to do more (or get more) of the things you do like -- and because now that you're feeling better, most of those things really aren't so bad as you used to think they were.
So my advice is to give yourself time to adjust. Even if your current lack of motivation leads you to skip some things you really should do for your general welfare, well, so be it. Lots of people fall behind but catch up later. Don't make yourself anxious about not being anxious. You've accomplished something you've wanted. Savor the accomplishment for awhile. The kinder you are to yourself, the quicker motivation will surface on its own.
Posted by Jen2 on January 26, 2005, at 21:31:06
In reply to Re: What does everyone do all day long?, posted by Iansf on January 26, 2005, at 20:06:51
This is an incredibly prescient and helpful post. Thank you. It's true - through all the anxiety and stress over many years, I've been striving at least in part for contentment - which is exactly what I've been feeling the past few days.
It's as though I've been working so hard over the years doing things that I didn't necessarily want to do, but had to do because others needed them to be done - and now I really don't give a crap what other people think because I feel good for the first time in years.
I have found it incredibly difficult in the past to cut myself any slack at all - so I appreciate your advice. I just have to spend some time now figuring out what it is that *I* like to do.
Jen
> I think you've hit on a general problem and one reason so many people say antidepressants make them apathetic. If you're used to using anxiety (along with the attendant guilt, worry, shame, etc.) as a motivator, once it's gone you don't a replacement to motivate you. After all, one of the things you've no doubt been striving for through everything you've done is contentment. You just didn't know how to get it. I'm sure there's been a fair amount of wasted energy put into things you thought would make you happy that never did.
>
> So if, thanks to a medication, you're now content, what's to strive for? Well, one thing is simply the enjoyment of doing. After you sit around feeling content for awhile and get comfortable with the idea the contentment isn't going to disapear, I think you'll discover the things you actually LIKE to do. And liking to do them will become the motivation for doing them. You'll also find you're more willing to do some things you don't like to do because doing them makes it possible to do more (or get more) of the things you do like -- and because now that you're feeling better, most of those things really aren't so bad as you used to think they were.
>
> So my advice is to give yourself time to adjust. Even if your current lack of motivation leads you to skip some things you really should do for your general welfare, well, so be it. Lots of people fall behind but catch up later. Don't make yourself anxious about not being anxious. You've accomplished something you've wanted. Savor the accomplishment for awhile. The kinder you are to yourself, the quicker motivation will surface on its own.
Posted by Minnie-Haha on January 27, 2005, at 10:22:12
In reply to Re: What does everyone do all day long?, posted by Iansf on January 26, 2005, at 20:06:51
> ... So if, thanks to a medication, you're now content, what's to strive for? Well, one thing is simply the enjoyment of doing. After you sit around feeling content for awhile and get comfortable with the idea the contentment isn't going to disapear, I think you'll discover the things you actually LIKE to do. And liking to do them will become the motivation for doing them. You'll also find you're more willing to do some things you don't like to do because doing them makes it possible to do more (or get more) of the things you do like -- and because now that you're feeling better, most of those things really aren't so bad as you used to think they were.
>
> So my advice is to give yourself time to adjust. Even if your current lack of motivation leads you to skip some things you really should do for your general welfare, well, so be it. Lots of people fall behind but catch up later. Don't make yourself anxious about not being anxious. You've accomplished something you've wanted. Savor the accomplishment for awhile. The kinder you are to yourself, the quicker motivation will surface on its own.These are really encouraging words. I am going to try to remember them!
Posted by 3 Beer Effect on January 27, 2005, at 21:37:47
In reply to What does everyone do all day long?, posted by Jen2 on January 26, 2005, at 16:58:09
I first sought treatment for depression while in college. In my opinion, people do not pay enough attention to the dumb drug effects of psych meds. Being dumb is in itself debilitating. (I can't imagine taking any of the Bipolar mood stabilizer or anti-psychotic meds, I would think the Zombie/brain numbing effect of those drugs would make you virtually unemployable).
In college I was taking Zoloft 100 mg + 1 or 2 mg of Klonopin. The Klonopin combined with the Zoloft short circuited my memory & I would blank out on tests. I also tried various other antidepressants including effexor, remeron, Celexa, Paxil & had similar dumbness/memory/apathy problems with each. Eventually I stopped taking them & only took ADD meds which definitely improve your motivation. The key might be to avoid benzos while in school b/c of the memory problems with them & avoid taking too many psychoactive meds at once.
I started taking generic Prozac 20 mg a few months ago & it is the only AD i've ever tried that does not cause dumbness. It actually motivates you to get out of bed, especially if you drink 2 cups of coffee with your 20 mg morning dose. There are perhaps some slight short term memory issues but they seem to be less significant that with any other med & your pace of thought seems to quicken with Prozac. I used to take it with Selegeline at 5 or 10 mg & that combination was activating & motivating but I quit that because of anxiety & dry mouth/eyes. The best combination for you is probably Prozac 20 mg + 20 mg 2x per day of either Dextrostat or Adderall or Ritalin. That is a powerful combo to defeat apathy & get you out of bed + you will have the cleanest house on your street! Another combo could be Prozac + Provigil or Prozac + Strattera or even Wellbutrin XL taken by itself.
In closing I would do what you can to bust a** while in grad school because although it may hurt now, you will be much happier later in life when you have a job in a field of interest that you like. I am taking a grad school class + working full time & Prozac + 2 cups of morning coffee & either 1 cup of coffee (or a Red Bull) at lunch makes it much easier since the Prozac gives you a great energy boost!
Thanks,
3 Beer Effect
Posted by Jen2 on January 27, 2005, at 21:57:15
In reply to I almost failed out of college from psych meds, posted by 3 Beer Effect on January 27, 2005, at 21:37:47
> In my opinion, people do not pay enough attention to the dumb drug effects of psych meds. Being dumb is in itself debilitating.
I completely agree. When I first started the Effexor ... well, when I was first in the throes of my anxiety/depression/paranoid freakout and couldn't think properly for weeks I thought I would never be able to get my head straight again. Then I started the Effexor and the side effects (that dissociated feeling) made me think that there was no hope at all and that I would have to drop out of school. But now I can think again! What a relief! I just need that extra push to get me out of bed and make me care!
> I started taking generic Prozac 20 mg a few months ago & it is the only AD i've ever tried that does not cause dumbness. It actually motivates you to get out of bed, especially if you drink 2 cups of coffee with your 20 mg morning dose.I have been avoiding caffeine for months because of the inevitable anxiety-provoking problems - but two days ago I had a soy latte and not only was it delicious, I did a phenomenal amount of work that evening. So I agree -- coffee has returned to a prominent place in my life. Caffeine is once again my friend.
> There are perhaps some slight short term memory issues but they seem to be less significant that with any other med & your pace of thought seems to quicken with Prozac.Yeah, well, I've always had short term memory issues, so that's OK.
Thanks for the advice re: the med combos. I'm off to my doc tomorrow so will raise these ideas then.
Jen
Posted by 3 Beer Effect on January 27, 2005, at 22:15:34
In reply to Re: I almost failed out of college from psych meds » 3 Beer Effect, posted by Jen2 on January 27, 2005, at 21:57:15
> Thanks for the advice re: the med combos. I'm off to my doc tomorrow so will raise these ideas then.
>
> JenJen,
If anxiety is one of your problems, I should tell you that Ritalin, although it helps you focus & seems to make you a bit smarter than equivalent doses of amphetamine, Ritalin does cause social anxiety. But if you are at the library or in your room studying you really shouldn't be socializing anyway!
If I were you I would take an ADD med called Dextrostat instead. It helps study/focus/concentration much like Ritalin but has much less anxiety & actually makes you more social if you have to talk to people or you take it before class (basically it lowers social inhibitions, increases confidence & ability to concentrate). Dextrostat is the same as Dexedrine which you may have heard of, but Dextrostat is better because it is available in 10 mg tablets while Dexedrine is only available in 5 mg tablets & it will take atleast 10 mg 2x per day to help you study. I took 20 mg 2x per day & that seemed like a perfect dose (for me). Adderall is also an option & is a best selling med, but it does cause a bit more anxiety than Dextrostat (but not near as much as Ritalin). It also lasts about 6 hours in the IR form while Dextrostat lasts around 4.5 hours & Ritalin 3.5 hours.
If your effexor is working for you now, I would not switch it to something else, because Prozac often takes a long time to start working (it took 5 weeks before I noticed a difference in depression, although its activating effects happens in the first few days. If the only problem with effexor is the apathy, the ADD med will take care of that right quick!
The main thing to remember is that one of the reasons I was doing poorly in college is that I used to stay up all night typing messages into this board! This is something you must absolutely avoid, because television & the internet are 2 of the biggest time wasters for students who procrastinate. Shut off your internet &/or TV cable if you have to & do all your research at the library where your less likely to read Psycho-Babble because people at the library will think your crazy if you read that, so that will likely keep anyone with anxiety (who often care too much what people think of them already) from looking up any website that hints of craziness, especially one with the name Psycho-Babble!
Good Luck,
3 Beer Effect
>
Posted by Jen2 on January 27, 2005, at 23:05:11
In reply to Re: I almost failed out of college from psych meds, posted by 3 Beer Effect on January 27, 2005, at 22:15:34
> The main thing to remember is that one of the reasons I was doing poorly in college is that I used to stay up all night typing messages into this board! This is something you must absolutely avoid, because television & the internet are 2 of the biggest time wasters for students who procrastinate. Shut off your internet &/or TV cable if you have to & do all your research at the library where your less likely to read Psycho-Babble ...
Here's more good advice from you! It's way too easy to become addicted / obsessed with these boards / email / the internet generally. The lack of motivation is just bolstered by the procrastination-inducing effects of the internet. Off I go - going to turn off the computer and go to bed.Thanks again,
Jen
This is the end of the thread.
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.