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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Lou Pilder on February 13, 2000, at 14:02:24
In reply to Re: Musical Hallucinations -QUESTION, posted by Lou Pilder on February 13, 2000, at 13:19:46
> > > have you guys seen neurologists?
> >
> > al here ...
> >
> > Should I see one? What are some possible etiologies?
> Tumor on brain--need an MRI for this.
> Tempoal lobe epilepsy--need a neurologist for this
> Ear mechinism disease--Need an Audiologist and a ear specialist for this
> Other problems
> Lou Pilder
There are references to vitamin and mineral defitiancies that can cause MH's Lou
Posted by Blue Cheer on February 15, 2000, at 18:40:37
In reply to Re: Musical COLORS????, posted by Lou Pilder on February 12, 2000, at 17:55:29
> > Hear colors??????? What on earth... no I don't think so. Your response made me laugh Lou, but seriously, do people really "hear colors"? What exactly does that mean? Sounds very intereting.
> > I also thought of people who have tinnitus. Maybe if there was something that worked for them would work for you (if there is anything).
>
> I was refeering to a rare phanominum where the senses are interchanged. I have never met a person with this and I thought ,perhaps, that there could be a link between that and MH's. If anyone out there has that, please let me know for I thought that the person with olfactory hallucinations could also have the other. Also, tinnatus management does not help with my condition. The music rises above any technique that a tinnatus sufferer uses.I also tried hearing aids. If you know anything else, please respond. I must have the music to stop
> Lou Pilder
"Synesthesia" or merging of the senses is a common phenomenon in psychedelic use. I "saw" sounds and "heard" colors while tripping on Orange Sunshine (LSD 250 mcg.) in the late 60's. I enjoyed it, but once I had to use chloral hydrate after it went on for almost 24 hours. ~~ Blue
Posted by Janet from Brazil on February 16, 2000, at 10:34:04
In reply to Re: Musical COLORS????, posted by Blue Cheer on February 15, 2000, at 18:40:37
> > > Hear colors??????? What on earth... no I don't think so. Your response made me laugh Lou, but seriously, do people really "hear colors"? What exactly does that mean? Sounds very intereting.
> > > I also thought of people who have tinnitus. Maybe if there was something that worked for them would work for you (if there is anything).
> >
> > I was refeering to a rare phanominum where the senses are interchanged. I have never met a person with this and I thought ,perhaps, that there could be a link between that and MH's. If anyone out there has that, please let me know for I thought that the person with olfactory hallucinations could also have the other. Also, tinnatus management does not help with my condition. The music rises above any technique that a tinnatus sufferer uses.I also tried hearing aids. If you know anything else, please respond. I must have the music to stop
> > Lou Pilder
>
>
> "Synesthesia" or merging of the senses is a common phenomenon in psychedelic use. I "saw" sounds and "heard" colors while tripping on Orange Sunshine (LSD 250 mcg.) in the late 60's. I enjoyed it, but once I had to use chloral hydrate after it went on for almost 24 hours. ~~ BlueIn, I believe Oliver Sacks book, the Man who mistook his wife for a Hat, he describes the case of an elderly lady who after a stroke, heard music from her Irish childhood playing continuously inside her head. It's a fascinating book. Jan
Posted by sadness lifting on February 17, 2000, at 13:53:25
In reply to Re: Musical COLORS????, posted by Janet from Brazil on February 16, 2000, at 10:34:04
have u ever thought of taking an atypical antipsycotic for your musical hallucinations? ask your doc about zyprexa; it has been heplful in removing hallucinations for me.
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Posted by k2 on August 16, 2003, at 23:33:26
In reply to Musical Hallucinations, posted by Lou Pilder on February 11, 2000, at 7:28:28
My family members have found relief with Neurontin, an anti-seizure medication. Tested negative for seizures, but the neurontin works great when the music got to be so much of a nuisance that it was disturbing the quality of life. An SSRI was also being used simultaneously, but did not make the music quiet down when used alone.
Posted by misk on October 31, 2003, at 15:57:02
In reply to Re: Musical Hallucinations, posted by k2 on August 16, 2003, at 23:33:26
ANY THOUGHTS? sudden onset, continuous,non-drug-related,non-psychotic musical/garbled voices/other sounds hallucinations. neurology continues to monitor but MRI and EEG do not show cause.
neurontin halfway helpful.
43yrs old now.
noises x4yrs, with some up&down deafness.
music is continuous,usually garbled,1st 6wks was elaborate never-heard-before beautiful&intrically orchestrated. varies now. several different noises at same time, spacially inside of head.
painfully loud, drowns out what hearing i have on the outside.
also hear dogs bark,tickertape machines,etc, voices garbled unintelligable.
ruled out ENT{NO physical EAR SITE cause for mostly continuous but not always deafness}, immune/bacterial, meningitis,or psychiatric.
hx headaches, cyclical neutropenia{mostly remission x6yrs}.
trouble writing,remembering words &trouble speaking remembered words also.
> My family members have found relief with Neurontin, an anti-seizure medication. Tested negative for seizures, but the neurontin works great when the music got to be so much of a nuisance that it was disturbing the quality of life. An SSRI was also being used simultaneously, but did not make the music quiet down when used alone.
Posted by misk on October 31, 2003, at 20:06:16
In reply to Re: Musical Hallucinations, posted by k2 on August 16, 2003, at 23:33:26
ANY THOUGHTS? sudden onset, continuous,non-drug-related,non-psychotic musical/garbled voices/other sounds hallucinations. neurology continues to monitor but MRI and EEG do not show cause.
neurontin halfway helpful.
43yrs old now.
noises x4yrs, with some up&down deafness.
music is continuous,usually garbled,1st 6wks was elaborate never-heard-before beautiful&intrically orchestrated. varies now. several different noises at same time, spacially inside of head.
painfully loud, drowns out what hearing i have on the outside.
also hear dogs bark,tickertape machines,etc, voices garbled unintelligable.
ruled out ENT{NO physical EAR SITE cause for mostly continuous but not always deafness}, immune/bacterial, meningitis,or psychiatric.
hx headaches, cyclical neutropenia{mostly remission x6yrs}.
trouble writing,remembering words &trouble speaking remembered words also.
> My family members have found relief with Neurontin, an anti-seizure medication. Tested negative for seizures, but the neurontin works great when the music got to be so much of a nuisance that it was disturbing the quality of life. An SSRI was also being used simultaneously, but did not make the music quiet down when used alone.
Posted by misk on October 31, 2003, at 20:27:28
In reply to Re: Musical COLORS????, posted by Sef on February 12, 2000, at 17:44:19
>{hope i am doing this right} there are meds for tinnititus. those type of meds didn't work for me for musical{or other pronounced/specific auditory} hallucinations. {you probably know tinnitius is usually characterized by buzzing, throbbing, or ringing in the ears} how'd i do?> Hear colors??????? What on earth... no I don't think so. Your response made me laugh Lou, but seriously, do people really "hear colors"? What exactly does that mean? Sounds very intereting.
> I also thought of people who have tinnitus. Maybe if there was something that worked for them would work for you (if there is anything).
Posted by EscherDementian on November 1, 2003, at 4:23:30
In reply to Musical Hallucinations, posted by Lou Pilder on February 11, 2000, at 7:28:28
Lou,
Just tonight i happened to send this article (below) to a friend with same complaint. Don't know if it will help you, but i surely understand your maddening frustration. At the least, i hope it brings a chuckle.Also~ i am one who hears colors/sees musical notes. i also 'hear' instrumental compositions visually. (Have since childhood.) But both senses are present simultaneously. Sometimes will see the music a moment before i hear it, and only once heard the color (blue) before i saw it. When a person says their own name, i see a lettering style (font), always unique and with texture. Often with a color also. And i've noticed a difference between what (spoken) sentences look like that are true, from lies. But all that's another post, when i have more time, if you're still interested. (I've got to go right now~~)
Here's that article:
According to University of Cincinnati marketing professor James Kellaris,
The Top 3 Songs That Get Stuck In Your Head are:
# "The Lion Sleeps Tonight"
# "Baby Back Ribs" jingle from Chili's Restaurant
# "Who Let the Dogs Out?"Kellaris calls it the playlist from hell. But that the real #1 song that gets stuck in our heads is different for each of us.(duh!) Kellaris has done so much research on this odd and annoying phenomenon that he's coined a term for it: "Earworm".
He told The Associated Press that Earworm is insidious; it might be the first song you hear on the clock radio that wakes you up, it could come from out of your distant childhood or teen years, could come from an elevator or the CD playing in the cubicle next to yours. "There are certain tunes that we would describe as catchy that are more likely to become one, but just about anything can become an Earworm," he told AP. His personal Earworm is Byzantine chants, which he suspects has something to do with his wife's job as a church choir director.
Stuck songs have these traits in common:
* They are relatively simple.
* They are repetitive.
* They contain an element that surprises the listener, such as an interrupted pattern or something that violates expectations of what comes next.
* The most common culprits are songs with lyrics.
* They stay stuck in our heads for a few hours on average, and can "hang around" for a couple days.There is no cure, but these treatments sometimes will work to rid your brain of the repetitive Earworm:
* Don't worry about it. (Take this advice, but DON'T think of Bobby McFerrin's "Don't Worry, Be Happy") ;-)
* Listen to different music.
* Try singing the entire song--and not just the snippet that's stuck in your head--even if you can't quite remember all the lyrics.
* If that doesn't work, go find the forgotten lyrics. Kellaris theorizes that Earworm is the brain's attempt to resolve missing information. By finding out the complete lyrics to a song, you might be able to "unstick" it.
* Erase the offending song by singing the theme from "Gilligan's Island." (LOL)
* Erase "Gilligan's Island" with another song that you like better.
* There's a folklore cure: Chew on cinnamon sticks. (Loudly, i'd imagine)(...My own personal solution that works 100% every time, has been to "give" the song to somebody else. Get it stuck in THEIR head. Preferably someone you're close enough with to hear them hum it and then groan "Aaargh!" when they realize they've "got it" in their head now. By the time we're done laughing, i'll notice it's no longer stuck in mine. My sister and husband have begun to do the same to ME, and it works for them, too. Aaargh!)
Kellaris' More Facts about Earworm:
* Women experience more irritation and frustration than men do from Earworms.
* People who are constantly exposed to music suffer from it more frequently.
* There may be a connection between Earworms and a person's level of neurosis. (Uh oh.)The research was presented at the Society for Consumer Psychology.
alright everyone sing along:
"WHAT'S NEW, Pussycat...Whoah whoah whoa-ho.."
;-)
(....sorry!)
Posted by EscherDementian on November 1, 2003, at 4:31:35
In reply to Songs That Get Stuck In Your Head » Lou Pilder, posted by EscherDementian on November 1, 2003, at 4:23:30
Posted by stjames on November 1, 2003, at 12:55:36
In reply to Re: Musical COLORS????, posted by misk on October 31, 2003, at 20:27:28
You are describing some of the features of
sub clinical epilepsy or sezure disorder.Try this test from Dr Bobs site & take a look
at the footnotes at the end:Indicators Suggestive of Subsyndromal Epilepsy
http://www.dr-bob.org/tips/isse.htmlgenerally this is the relm of the neurologist,
seek them for a work up and possible treatment.
There used to be some posters here with this, they do not post here anymore.
Posted by misk on November 1, 2003, at 17:41:35
In reply to Subsyndromal Epilepsy, posted by stjames on November 1, 2003, at 12:55:36
>stjames - much appreciate your post.
'll pass along the test&info to my neurologist. this' ruining my life.
take care yourself - misk<
> You are describing some of the features of sub clinical epilepsy or sezure disorder. Try this test - -
Posted by misk on November 1, 2003, at 18:06:12
In reply to Re: Musical COLORS????, posted by Lou Pilder on February 12, 2000, at 17:55:29
>have you found relief?hope so.
been 4yrs for me.my neuro md thinks a brain injury, internal,a guess becz tests don't show anything.says nerve cells/synapses/tissue should repair themselves partially &SOME hearing restoration,takes 4-6yrs tho. meantime,treat palliatively{relieve symptoms}.
the sub-something atypical epilesy posting here might be useful,i don't know.
hope you had better luck than me so far. take care - misk<> If you know anything else, please respond. I must have the music to stop
> Lou Pilder
Posted by stjames on November 1, 2003, at 18:34:50
In reply to Re: the noise must stop » Lou Pilder, posted by misk on November 1, 2003, at 18:06:12
Lou was banned for a year. You might be able to find
his e-mail address off his posts.
Posted by EscherDementian on November 1, 2003, at 19:27:12
In reply to Subsyndromal Epilepsy, posted by stjames on November 1, 2003, at 12:55:36
i am one who hears colors/sees musical notes.
i also 'hear' instrumental compositions visually. (Have since childhood.) But i'm not sure it's the same as Subsyndromal Epilepsy. I have never considered it "hallucinations", although talking about it as a child to my father or babysitters evoked "just seeing things/imagining things" commentary.Both senses are present simultaneously. Now, as an adult, the dominant sense is the "normal" one. But i can switch it, it's a matter of focus. Sometimes will see the music a moment before i hear it, and only once heard the color (blue) before i saw it.
Each note consistantly has the same color, different instruments have different 'texture' in what i see. The color lasts as long as i hear the note and fades accordingly.A color's sound is affected by the physical material of the object, but in general same 'frequency'(?) consistancy. (example: the pale blue of the calendar border next to me on the wall is the same as the pale blue shade of the earthenware bowl on my desk here. The sound (or note) i hear is the same, but the 'tone' is different. The bowl is slightly"scrabbly"- deeper sounding, the calendar is light- smoother.)
A color's note/tone is sustained as long as i'm looking at it, or becomes a lesser part of an object or room's sound.All voices are in color.
When a person says their own name, i can see a lettering style (font), unique to their voice, with texture. And i've noticed a difference between what talking looks like when it's true, from untrue -to the speaker's experience (no beforehand knowledge of what i'm hearing, discovery accuracy 100%).It's much MUCH easier for me to tune down sounds than colors to sub-noticeability.
Smells also come with visual appearances and note/tone sound. (& very sensitive olfactory)
Tastes also, but i tune those out the most. Except things like salt. Salt is very loud. Can't tune out salt.
Oh- tastes can come with correlating whole body movements. It's simultaneous, but they're not involuntary. My husband loves it when i show him. We have alot of fun with "This is the ______ dance".i took the test at http://www.dr-bob.org/tips/isse.html , but it seemed to me that my score was low (26), and the breakdown had %s that were either 0 OR high%. Not sure if my experience is the same as the questions described.
No seizure events, but i'm curious now.i thought surely these perceptions are not uncommon. ~~Anyone else?
Escher
Posted by stjames on November 1, 2003, at 22:01:40
In reply to Re: Subsyndromal Epilepsy/Musical colors, posted by EscherDementian on November 1, 2003, at 19:27:12
> i am one who hears colors/sees musical notes.
> i also 'hear' instrumental compositions visually. (Have since childhood.)This also is called synistasia (sp?). It is quite
common with the stronger hallucinagenic drugs.
> i took the test at http://www.dr-bob.org/tips/isse.html , but it seemed to me that my score was low (26), and the breakdown had %s that were either 0 OR high%. Not sure if my experience is the same as the questions described.
> No seizure events, but i'm curious now.Seizure disorder has a huge range; quite
a number of kinds never involve a convulsion
or classic seizure, ever. BP is in some way related to seizure disorders.>
> i thought surely these perceptions are not uncommon. ~~Anyone else?
>
> EscherI understand that many have had this happen
from time to time. Neurology does mis-fire from time to time and pathways get crossed. It is only
a problem if it bothers you, I would think 24/7
music/color would be a bit too much for most people.I have heard of these things happening during manic phase of BP.
Posted by misk on November 2, 2003, at 13:54:53
In reply to Re: the noise must stop, posted by stjames on November 1, 2003, at 18:34:50
>how does someone get banned from the site? just so i don't do it {hah} -misk<
Posted by misk on November 2, 2003, at 14:04:56
In reply to Re: Subsyndromal Epilepsy/Musical colors, posted by EscherDementian on November 1, 2003, at 19:27:12
>in reply to your posting. do you think maybe the visual hits 1st,which stimulates/evokes the corresponding note/colours? curious. take care-misk<
Posted by Larry Hoover on November 2, 2003, at 15:55:07
In reply to Re: getting banned, posted by misk on November 2, 2003, at 13:54:53
> >how does someone get banned from the site? just so i don't do it {hah} -misk<
I think it's best if you just read the FAQ. The link is at the top of the Babble page.
Lar
Posted by misk on November 3, 2003, at 13:07:05
In reply to Re: getting banned » misk, posted by Larry Hoover on November 2, 2003, at 15:55:07
>lar thx- i'm not so great maneuvering sites &appreciate the signposts below: never thought of there. always good to know what potholes not to stumble into. &ps {hah}s are at me,just for future ref,i find enough to laugh about in myself rather than at anyone else. thx! misk<
> > >how does someone get banned from the site? just so i don't do it {hah} -- misk<
>I think it's best if you just read the FAQ. The link is at the top of the Babble page.
> > Lar
Posted by T_R_D on November 4, 2003, at 11:29:53
In reply to Re: Musical COLORS????, posted by misk on October 31, 2003, at 20:27:28
Yes it is fascinating...it's called synaesthesia...look it up; you'll be amazed!
Posted by T_R_D on November 4, 2003, at 11:41:49
In reply to Re: Subsyndromal Epilepsy/Musical colors, posted by EscherDementian on November 1, 2003, at 19:27:12
Hey Escher! I posted earlier in this thread...you are what is known as a Synaesthete--one who suffers from or is gifted with (depending upon your perspective) Synaesthesia. I find it absolutely fascinating!
You're cool :)
Take care,
Karen
Posted by EscherDementian on November 6, 2003, at 5:14:58
In reply to Re: Subsyndromal Epilepsy/Musical colors » EscherDementian, posted by misk on November 2, 2003, at 14:04:56
> >in reply to your posting. do you think maybe the visual hits 1st,which stimulates/evokes the corresponding note/colours? curious. take care-misk<
>
>
>The more i have looked into this, the less sure i am that my experience is Subsyndromal Epilepsy...
As an adult, now, my simultaneous multiple sensory is easily and habitually diminished to the "normal" or "common" sense being dominant, or the only one noticed, unless i focus otherwise.
So _now_ it seems that visual is noticed first in 'physical seeing'. Hmmmm... music and it's color is still always simultaneous, but the color is just not the dominant thing i 'notice'.
Only once that i remember did i hear a color (and it was LOUD, too) before i saw it. i was 13yrs old. Might've happened more, but that one "loud blue" time really startled me.
Only a sparse few times have i 'seen/felt' the color flow before recognizing it as music.i have no idea how i learned to discriminate, but it has gotten 'quieter' and less 'noticeable' as i've gotten older. It's really no big deal at all, now. It IS very 'natural' to me when i am functioning artistically. i'd perhaps feel 'blind' or 'deaf' without it at those times, i don't know.
Hope i've been able to describe it well enough, Misk? i sat and observed, to try to dissect the timing or mechanism, but i'm afraid it's too responsive to intentional focus now.
i wish you the best in your journey with these experiences... the very best.
Take care,Escher
Posted by misk on November 7, 2003, at 17:40:42
In reply to Re: Subsyndromal Epilepsy, posted by stjames on November 1, 2003, at 22:01:40
>LSD lowers serotonin re-uptake{basically the ability of brain to utilize serotonin,one of the brain's chemicals, creating lowered serotonin circulation&activity in the brain} which causes the psychodelic's infamous hallucinations.
Low serotonin levels can happen naturally too{see an example below}, sometimes enough to cause hallucinations.
I'm not saying serotonin is the ONLY reason behind hallucinations tho.
Also, reading the postings here, it's obvious some hallucinatory experiences are pleasant, while others are nightmarish.Low serotonin is also infamous for causing depression. Or, some argue,depression can change the brain enough to cause a state of low serotonin. and/OR,others say, it's a vicious cycle that perpetuates itself in a dog-chasing-its-tail pattern. Can be a short-term or a chronic problem. -- Misk<
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