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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by Shari H. on June 17, 2003, at 7:44:15
In reply to new symptom: inordinate sweating!!, posted by zinya on June 16, 2003, at 18:17:37
Yes, sweating was a side effect for me especially at the beginning. Mine cam mostly in the form of night sweats. I would wake up in the middle of the night needing to completely change evrything I was wearing. I have been on Effexor for 15 months now and it hasen't happened in awhile (about a year) so it should go away after a few months once your body adapts.
Posted by StefL on June 17, 2003, at 16:37:36
In reply to Re: I am scared of this medicine, HELP ME!, posted by Susy on June 13, 2003, at 22:46:07
Hi all, new to this group & new to the med game. I was on Lexapro for depression, got so agitated I was loosing it! New doc lead to bipolar diagnosis. She dropped me down to .5mg of the Lexapro & started me on Trileptal. After 2 weeks, not feeling any better & not sleeping well, she upped me to 900mg Trileptal. But she also added Ambien & Abilify at the same time. Having never heard of Abilify, started to search the web & found you guys! But most of what I read about it scared me! Last night was my first PM with the higher Trileptal dose & both the Ambian & Abilify. I thought that was a little much to start new all at one time, but that's what the doc said! Last night I felt light headed & shakey. And today I still do, but I feel more sick to my stomach than anything! It's so awful I could barely drive & actually got pulled over this morning! The doc says stick with it. Any advice? Anyone had similar med combos? I'd appreciate anything anyone can offer on this topic! Thanks for your time! StefL
Posted by zinya on June 17, 2003, at 17:30:28
In reply to Re: new symptom: inordinate sweating!!, posted by Shari H. on June 17, 2003, at 7:44:15
thanks to all of you for responding!
Indeed, Shari, just last night a new wrinkle got added to my symptoms, one that would seem to fall into your experience, except for one variation:
Last night i fell asleep at an hour i *never* fall asleep, which was in advance of taking my pill. I had still been dealing with sweats off and on yesterday and evening (plus a nonstop 2-day left-temple damnable headache), but when I awoke from this inadvertent "nap" it was 3:45 in the morning, completely damp, sheets, nightshirt, me... ugh! when i returned to bed, only by fluke, thinking about it being the first time sweating had awakened me, it dawned on me that i'd failed to take my Effexor, about 4-5 hours overdue. I know posters have said here that if they miss a dose by 3 hrs or more, they start to feel side effects. I immediately took my dose but wondered if the sweating-myself-awake had actually been a *withdrawal* effect rather than a regular side effect getting more pronounced with time (since it just started last Sat.)
But my guess now from reading your post is that you would wager it was not so much withdrawal (the 5-hour delay) as it was a part of the process of adapting to the drug. Is that right, Shari? Or anyone?
It's also most reassuring to here that it passes. I've already had more than enough of this side effect, even though there's no pain involved and should seem 'harmless' it sure makes even the prospect of socializing all the more remote.
At least, knock on wood, the 2-day headache seems gone today.
wishing you all okay,
zinya
Posted by brian green on June 17, 2003, at 17:49:05
In reply to New needing help!, posted by StefL on June 17, 2003, at 16:37:36
Hi stef, no experience with those except the Ambien. Interested to hear more about the rediagnose to bipolar.
Brian
Posted by NThompson on June 17, 2003, at 19:41:21
In reply to Re: My First Day on Effexor » NThompson, posted by zinya on June 14, 2003, at 12:50:25
Thank you for the words of incouragement. Today is day five and my effexor has been raised to 75mg along with the paxil 25mg. I think I am doing okay. Still don't quite like who and what I see in the mirror yet, but I'm getting there. I still feel guilty for what I have done and that means everything! But I want to be here. And my husband, well, he is awesome. For him to love me so much that he is still with me... he is helping me in every way, shape and form. From doing all of the bills with me, calling me from work to see if I'm alright, to asking me how my day was when he gets home, to helping with kids and house work. On top of that, he compliments me and tells me how much he loves and needs me in his life. We are communicating great now. I actually feel like I can talk to him! Before when I was hiding everything I would purposely get into arguements so he wouldn't talk to me. Just incase the topic came to the bank account or bills. Now, it is great. We have spent hours talking. I understand that he doesn't trust me with the account and bills anymore and he's still angry about me lying and hiding things from him, but he doesn't remind me of it. That's not something he is harping on. He just wants to help me feel and get better. We are even going away this weekend to Carson City, NV, just us, no kids! We have some friends going for the amature car races and they have a room at a hotel that we are staying in--really nice of them to share. All we have to worry about is gas and food. I can't wait.
I appreciate your words of incouragement. I like talking to someone who really knows what I feel like. You seem so sweet, thank you.
Write me again, anytime!
Nyia
Posted by NThompson on June 17, 2003, at 19:58:57
In reply to New needing help!, posted by StefL on June 17, 2003, at 16:37:36
Hi there StefL. I'm glad you found us. This is my second time being here too. So I'm new also. Five days ago I started 25mg of Paxil along with now 75 mg of Effexor to take in the mornings. And I'm taking Trazadone 50mg at night so that I can sleep. Feeling kinda weird myself but my doctor said that when my body gets use to the meds I should be fine. However, if your having these side effects and they aren't getting better, I would talk to your doctor about re-medicating you differently. The whole purpose of these meds are to help us feel better right? So, if they aren't, and getting pulled over doesn't help you feel good, change them or the dosage. If this doctor isn't helping you or listening to you the way you want them to, change doctors. Yes, doctors are there to help you, but you need one you are comfortable with.
I hope you are starting to feel better and this is a very scary thing to deal with. I hope you have a good support system at home! If not you can always get in touch with me or us on the posts. That is why we are here. To help give and get support from people who won't judge because we are there and living the same thing you are.
Congratulations for reaching out, great step to take!
I'm here for you!
NThompson
Posted by medlib on June 17, 2003, at 20:18:34
In reply to New needing help!, posted by StefL on June 17, 2003, at 16:37:36
Hi Stef--
Welcome to Babble! The mechanics of this board can be confusing, but I think that you might get a better response if you reposted your inquiry as a new thread. You can do that by scrolling down to the bottom of the page to "Start a new thread" and click on "Go to Form". That way, your questions about Lexapro-Trileptal-Ambien-Abilify won't get lost in someone else's thread about Effexor. (There's been a running thread about Effexor ever since I joined PB in '99.)
That said, I think that there's not much logic to making several med changes at once, and I wouldn't respect a pdoc (psychiatrist) who did so. You can't know now whether the SEs (side effects) you're experiencing are caused by increasing the Trileptal or starting Abilify. Similarly, you won't know which is responsible for any improvement you may experience. Ambien is a short-acting sleep med, so it is less likely to be a culprit.
From what you've told us, your pdoc's actions seem precipitate, if not ill-considered. It's particularly helpful to be clear about the nature of a chronic medical problem at the outset and to understand the long-term treatment strategy proposed--not just the "whats", but the "whys". If I were you, I'd seek a second opinion on your dx (diagnosis) and meds ASAP. In the meantime, there are many excellent resources available to learn more about bipolar disorders and meds. Babble has quite a number of well-informed bipolar posters who can share their experiences and favorite resources with you.
Good luck and keep posting!---medlib
Posted by lovemybabies on June 17, 2003, at 20:28:59
In reply to Re: inordinate sweating!! to Sierra, Rickey and » Shari H., posted by zinya on June 17, 2003, at 17:30:28
Hi.
I've been on Effexor for five months. Since upping the dose to 150mg, I've had night sweats about three times a week. Mostly my legs sweat. ??? Bizarre. It's never happened during the day. I think if I get the LEAST bit warm during the night, my body goes into overdrive with the sweating. I'm not hot at all--cold and clammy, like you mentioned. No other side effects, really except VIVID dreams and constipation. Lovely, eh?
Jen
Posted by zinya on June 17, 2003, at 20:41:15
In reply to Re: inordinate sweating!! to Sierra, Rickey and, posted by lovemybabies on June 17, 2003, at 20:28:59
hmm, yeah, i know whatcha mean ... the constipation too... aargh.
I'm curious: Do you take your Effex. at night too? I wonder if it has anything to do with number of hours after a new dose cycling thru the body?? I know XR is supposed to be time released but i imagine there's some variation, isn't there? or not? I guess, come to think of it, there shouldn't be that much w/ time release but i am just now processing that for the first time actually ...
thanks for responding -- How long have you been at the 150 dose? have you noticed a change in something you might think of as adrenalin levels? energy? What positive benefits have you felt?
zinya
Posted by Nissy on June 17, 2003, at 21:21:49
In reply to Re: inordinate sweating!! to Sierra, Rickey and » lovemybabies, posted by zinya on June 17, 2003, at 20:41:15
Hi guys,
I just found this site. I can so relate to the sweating. I take 300 mg of Effexor XR in the morning and I sweat my butt off. I will be getting ready to go out and my head will sweat and it will run down my face. So much for the make-up, huh? I do get hot easier it seems and most of the sweating is from my scalp. I just recently got my hair cut really short but it didn't help much. I wish I knew of something to help this problem. I also have been on Effexor for several years and the sweating hasn't ever gone away. I have also tried to go off of it but also had serious side effects and had to go back on it to get relief. I went through an entire pregnancy on it and my daughter seems to be just fine, thank God.
I also have the constipation. I also noticed in my stool the little white "balls" that are inside of the Effexor capsule. Aren't they suposta desolve? Anyone else have this?
Thanks
Nissy
Have a good one,
Nissy
Posted by CherC68 on June 17, 2003, at 22:23:23
In reply to Re: Sweating and other stuff, posted by Nissy on June 17, 2003, at 21:21:49
Hi everyone. I'm still keeping up with the posts and wanted to let you all know that I am thinking about all of you and wishing you all no SE's, and no anxiety.
I've been off Effexor for 9 days now and I'm not on anything, but know I need some kind of help and friggin' soon! I have never had a drinking problem, drinking rarely to occasionally and I'm going to grab a wine cooler I just bought because I'm thinking I need something to sleep. I'm a bit upset about it.
Last Thursday I went to my doctor (who's an internist and prescribed the Zoloft first and the Effexor XR. I couldn't follow through with either cause of the SE freaking me out too much (I'm probably a hypochondriac). He wanted me to see the shrink there, and had the nurse give me name & the recommendation so I can get the appointment. When the nurse tried to give it to me - I told her I'd pass. Another Big Mistake, huh!
I am feeling the anxiety already pushing up, the stress building, the panic and...I miss the 6 days of no cares, no worries, nothing matters, so what of the Effexor (except the SE's) but I CANNOT do the SE again,I'd just lose it completely.
I know I should not be posting in this section of Babble re: Effexor, but...you guys were all so nice to me on the Effexor.
I truly hope you are all doing well, and getting good sleep, NO Side Effects, and true happiness.
Thanks for listening to me.
Hugs, Cher
Posted by CaptainD500 on June 17, 2003, at 22:36:49
In reply to Re: Sweating and other stuff, posted by Nissy on June 17, 2003, at 21:21:49
Hi All,
It's interesting that everyone seems to be having a sweating problem, which I have not encountered, YET. However, I always sweat anyway so I'm not sure I would tell the difference, especially when it gets 100+ degrees here in Texas.
Currently I am on day 10 at 150mg and I did have something interesting happen today. Normally I'm quite fatigued all day, but this morning I actually had some energy that lasted through noon, then I became somewhat agitated for the remainder of my day. I am once again fatigued and about to try to go to bed and get some sleep, but I'm still a little wound up. Other than that, I'm just peachy! :) At least I can keep my sense of humor, for now.
Obviously I am just a novice at this whole AD thing and I am not qualified to advise anyone else, but I can just tell you my experiences and learn by your experiences. I enjoy reading the posts and appreciate the information that I am getting from it.
Take care all,
Cap
Posted by brian green on June 17, 2003, at 22:39:06
In reply to Re: Sweating and other stuff, posted by CherC68 on June 17, 2003, at 22:23:23
> Hi everyone. I'm still keeping up with the posts and wanted to let you all know that I am thinking about all of you and wishing you all no SE's, and no anxiety.
>
> I've been off Effexor for 9 days now and I'm not on anything, but know I need some kind of help and friggin' soon! I have never had a drinking problem, drinking rarely to occasionally and I'm going to grab a wine cooler I just bought because I'm thinking I need something to sleep. I'm a bit upset about it.
>
> Last Thursday I went to my doctor (who's an internist and prescribed the Zoloft first and the Effexor XR. I couldn't follow through with either cause of the SE freaking me out too much (I'm probably a hypochondriac). He wanted me to see the shrink there, and had the nurse give me name & the recommendation so I can get the appointment. When the nurse tried to give it to me - I told her I'd pass. Another Big Mistake, huh!
>
> I am feeling the anxiety already pushing up, the stress building, the panic and...I miss the 6 days of no cares, no worries, nothing matters, so what of the Effexor (except the SE's) but I CANNOT do the SE again,I'd just lose it completely.
>
> I know I should not be posting in this section of Babble re: Effexor, but...you guys were all so nice to me on the Effexor.
>
> I truly hope you are all doing well, and getting good sleep, NO Side Effects, and true happiness.
>
> Thanks for listening to me.
> Hugs, CherCher, advise. Go see the shrink, right away. You are doing exactly what I did, and I cruised for a while at low function and then one day suicide was creeping in. Next day I had to check in to the hosptial where I was back on Effexor in a controlled, medical enviroment. The side effects were treated there and I am glad it happened to me, but you have an opportunity with the pdoc to do it out of the hosp. Am I making sense?
B
Posted by brian green on June 17, 2003, at 22:49:56
In reply to Re: Sweating and other stuff, posted by CaptainD500 on June 17, 2003, at 22:36:49
Cap, I am not really a novice, but this my second bout with depression has been a learning experience that I shall not soon forget. I at at 375 mg and I have never had a side effect other than feeling better. I add Wellbutrin in the morning now ever since a setback last week. I am keeping a fairly good mood through almost everything, even practically losing my job because of this disability. ( I am on temp dis now because my company can't find a place for me to return to 1/2 days until I am well, and my perfomance was so poor while I have been barely functioning for the past 2 years, they are probably not too hip on my coming back at all). Anyway, I am sure your doc will bump you up gradually, it should be about time for you. My bumps have come at my desperation to my pdoc when I would call him and tell him I was feeling bad. Glad to talk to you.
B
Posted by CaptainD500 on June 17, 2003, at 22:54:55
In reply to Re: Sweating and other stuff, posted by brian green on June 17, 2003, at 22:49:56
Thanks Brian for the tip. I am going to schedule an appointment with my pdoc soon, there are a lot of questions I have to ask him. Glad you're doing better now. Keep your chin up. Cya.
Cap
Posted by zinya on June 17, 2003, at 23:15:23
In reply to To Zinya from NThompson » zinya, posted by NThompson on June 17, 2003, at 19:41:21
gosh, NT, your news sounds very good. Solid. And like the beginnings of a real silver lining. And you get "credit" don't forget, even though not in the way you'll hopefully ever think is the only way again, but for sounding the alarm -- as much to yourself perhaps -- and finding a way to emerge from the hiding. And sounds like you've got a real partner there, the kind who first and foremost is a friend, a best friend. That's the best kind of spouse, imo.
I'm here for anything you want to talk about, and for things like wishing you a wonderful weekend ... Sometimes it's darkest just before the dawn. I think you've found dawn.
:)
zinya
Posted by zinya on June 17, 2003, at 23:24:20
In reply to Re: Sweating and other stuff, posted by CherC68 on June 17, 2003, at 22:23:23
Hi Cher!
it's great that you're still posting here too... plus never hesitate to e-mail me either. I know i've been a bit erratic lately in responding for a variety of reasons...
I'm so sorry to hear what sounds like angst for lack of a better word... Since it sounds like you yourself feel you should have taken the name of the shrink, why not just call your doctor's office and ask for it by phone and follow it up?
We all should probably be having a "p-doc" as they seem to call shrinks here, if only cuz they have to be more aware of side effects and fine-tuning a-d's than your avg (or even above avg) internist... Like mine who knew nothing about side effects!! sheesh.
As noted, i'm having a week of sweats - and at the moment my right thumb won't "work" :)) -- which i doubt has anything to do with anything but it's making typing a bit painful so i'm going to sign off here.
speaking of hands, what's the news on yours?
with love and hugs and wanting relief for you soon!
Posted by NThompson on June 18, 2003, at 0:28:53
In reply to new symptom: inordinate sweating!!, posted by zinya on June 16, 2003, at 18:17:37
Hi there! Thanks for writing me back. This is day 5 on effexor and I am HOPING that me feeling hot is just the weather here. These side effects are starting to scare me. Does effexor really work? Or am I adding more stress and anxiety into my life? I'm only at 75mg now. My P-doc is slowly moving up to see how I feel and do. I hope I don't get the sweats that bad. I hope yours goes away and soon!
I have noticed that I have been having a tension/migraine type headache the last few days and Tylenol and 800mg Ibruprofen isn't doing anything. Is it okay to take vicodin on effexor? Do you know?
Well I am new here and I feel really comfortable talking to you. If you would allow me to share in your story, I'd love to hear it. I'll understand if you're tired of telling it. I think these posts are a wonderful way of getting info and sharing things with people who aren't going to judge you, at least not in a negative way!
Well, as far as the side effects, try to hold on. I know that my p-doc told me that there were a few but most are suppose to eventually go away. Now I don't know if he meant that they will go away when your body gets use to it or when they decide to take you off the meds, but there is hope! Sorry that I don't know anything about this med. I wish I could help you out.
Take care and write soon
Nyia
Posted by brian green on June 18, 2003, at 0:49:44
In reply to Re: new symptom: inordinate sweating!! » zinya, posted by NThompson on June 18, 2003, at 0:28:53
nyia, ask the pharmacist the vicodin question. Is Effexor good? I am having good luck with it. I think you will too as it is considered in the medical community to be highly effective. Independent data I have read indicated it to be the best for most depression cases. Of course we are all different, but I have never heard of anyone taking it and once they got over the hump, they were glad they stuck with it. (this is from experience with folks outside the contributors to this site.) I am at 6 weeks almost, 375 mg.
I wish you luck, and i am also here for you should you need me.
Brian
Posted by melley on June 18, 2003, at 6:01:57
In reply to Anyone had success on Effexor XR? , posted by jp on October 24, 1999, at 14:59:14
yesterday I took my last dose of 37.5 mg of effexor. Down from 225 mg. And am now fully on wellbutrin, 300 mg. I have no discernable side effects at all and feel great. I hope I don't have more withdrawal. Spent two weeks at each lower dose. It is so wonderful. I can't believe I stayed on effexor a whole year! I hope it works for others but wasn't for me, I now know.
Posted by KimberlyDi on June 18, 2003, at 10:14:03
In reply to Re: Sweating and other stuff, posted by CherC68 on June 17, 2003, at 22:23:23
Cher:
Glad you posted. You have plenty to contribute with your experience going onto Effexor & the SE's, along with your experience going off (withdrawals). I'm on Day 19. I'm up to 150 daily. Very few side effects. But its getting rougher. I'm feeling more depressed. The emtional *insulation* Effexor gives me must be getting thinner. I can feel the anxiety out there about to break through. I see the pdoc tomorrow.
Good luck. p.s. it shouldn't be too late for you to schedule that appointment with the *shrink*!
Kim> Hi everyone. I'm still keeping up with the posts and wanted to let you all know that I am thinking about all of you and wishing you all no SE's, and no anxiety.
>
> I've been off Effexor for 9 days now and I'm not on anything, but know I need some kind of help and friggin' soon! I have never had a drinking problem, drinking rarely to occasionally and I'm going to grab a wine cooler I just bought because I'm thinking I need something to sleep. I'm a bit upset about it.
>
> Last Thursday I went to my doctor (who's an internist and prescribed the Zoloft first and the Effexor XR. I couldn't follow through with either cause of the SE freaking me out too much (I'm probably a hypochondriac). He wanted me to see the shrink there, and had the nurse give me name & the recommendation so I can get the appointment. When the nurse tried to give it to me - I told her I'd pass. Another Big Mistake, huh!
>
> I am feeling the anxiety already pushing up, the stress building, the panic and...I miss the 6 days of no cares, no worries, nothing matters, so what of the Effexor (except the SE's) but I CANNOT do the SE again,I'd just lose it completely.
>
> I know I should not be posting in this section of Babble re: Effexor, but...you guys were all so nice to me on the Effexor.
>
> I truly hope you are all doing well, and getting good sleep, NO Side Effects, and true happiness.
>
> Thanks for listening to me.
> Hugs, Cher
Posted by KimberlyDi on June 18, 2003, at 12:22:29
In reply to Re: Sweating and other stuff, posted by CaptainD500 on June 17, 2003, at 22:36:49
Howdy!
I don't have the sweating effect either from Effexor and I'm from TX also. Wonder if Texans tolerance to long hot summers has anything to do with it? hmmmmmmmm. interesting.
Kim
> Hi All,
>
> It's interesting that everyone seems to be having a sweating problem, which I have not encountered, YET. However, I always sweat anyway so I'm not sure I would tell the difference, especially when it gets 100+ degrees here in Texas.
>
> Currently I am on day 10 at 150mg and I did have something interesting happen today. Normally I'm quite fatigued all day, but this morning I actually had some energy that lasted through noon, then I became somewhat agitated for the remainder of my day. I am once again fatigued and about to try to go to bed and get some sleep, but I'm still a little wound up. Other than that, I'm just peachy! :) At least I can keep my sense of humor, for now.
>
> Obviously I am just a novice at this whole AD thing and I am not qualified to advise anyone else, but I can just tell you my experiences and learn by your experiences. I enjoy reading the posts and appreciate the information that I am getting from it.
>
> Take care all,
> Cap
Posted by KimberlyDi on June 18, 2003, at 12:29:26
In reply to no more effexor, posted by melley on June 18, 2003, at 6:01:57
Glad your switch to Wellbutrin is working for you. Doubly glad you didn't give up on AD's <hint hint Cher!> Keep on posting. I'm curious if you have any delayed withdrawal effects from Effexor.
Good luck! Kim
> yesterday I took my last dose of 37.5 mg of effexor. Down from 225 mg. And am now fully on wellbutrin, 300 mg. I have no discernable side effects at all and feel great. I hope I don't have more withdrawal. Spent two weeks at each lower dose. It is so wonderful. I can't believe I stayed on effexor a whole year! I hope it works for others but wasn't for me, I now know.
Posted by NThompson on June 18, 2003, at 12:53:19
In reply to Re: new symptom: inordinate sweating!!, posted by brian green on June 18, 2003, at 0:49:44
Brian,
Thanks for writing me back. I keep seeing all the side effects that everyone is posting and it's scary! I will stick with it though. I want to just feel good about myself, however the weight gain side effect I definately don't want to get. But on the flip side of that, when I'm depressed I eat and when I'm not depressed I actually get up and do things, activities, and don't seem to eat as much either. Probably a catch 22! :)Yesterday I was bumbed from 37.5 to 75mg of Effexor. I felt a little weird and has a headache. I don't have one today though. I have already taken my pills for the day. No night sweats or anything else yet! :)
I was online reading and writing posts when my husband came in and asked what I was doing. I told him I was in a support group, thinking he was going to laugh at me or think I was weird. He surpised me though. He asked if he could read a couple with me and asked to see what I've written, so I showed him. He thought it was a great idea! He said it is good for me to be talking to others who are actually going through the same feelings and situations that I am. Because he doesn't have depression and has never been on any meds execpt Tylenol, he doesn't quite get what I'm going through. He said great idea and keep doing it. I felt really good about that. Man he's being really supportive about this. It's almost scary. But in a good way.
So Brian, what made you take that leap onto Effexor. Mine you know. It took me to the edge to seek help. How did you know you needed help?
I hope you don't mind me asking. Thanks for being here for me, and if you need to talk too, I'm here for you also. This would be awful to go through alone.Take care of yourself,
Nyia
Posted by CherC68 on June 18, 2003, at 17:27:02
In reply to Thanks Brian Re: Effexor » brian green, posted by NThompson on June 18, 2003, at 12:53:19
Hi everyone! Okay, so I took all of your advise and tried to get the name and an appointment of the PDoc my internist tried to give me. Guess what? They friggin' don't have a pdog there. They do have therapists though, which is great and all, but...that means no meds of any type. Plus, now they are not sure if my insurance will cover a therapist or pdoc (its Cigna I'm sure it will), but I have to go outside the clinic to find a PDoc.
I will get around to doing that sometime this weekend. I am going through 4-5 panic attacks a day right now, I'm ready to cry at any given time, I'm just stressed out.
Husband is out of town for work again, new windows are being installed tomorrow and I have to try to move all the furniture from the windows. That is why I have to put this off, and hang on a few more days.
Nyia, I am so happy that you sound like you are doing much better now. I'm glad things are working for you. Please keep up the posts, everyone is here for you.
Thank you all, and Brian and Kimberly, I am taking your advise, and Zinya, I will write you more later.
Take Care everyone!
Hugs, Cher
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