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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 14 of 14. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by cubbybear on December 29, 2002, at 3:37:29
This note is specially intended for bluedog and LyndaK plus anyone else who was following my previous posts about experimenting with Moclobemide (Aurorix) to prevent future depressive relapses. Even if you were not following these posts in Nov.-early Dec., perhaps you have something to say anyway.
Just to recap: During a period of tranquility after stopping Zoloft, I switched to Aurorix to see if it could PREVENT any depressive relapses in the future .I just wanted to completely get away from the miserable SSRI scene, and had had great results with MAOI Parnate in the past.
Well, unfortunately I had a depressive relapse this week. I had been taking the low dose of 300 mg Aurorix for 3 weeks, and then wham--depression again. But the relapse didn't just come out of the blue: extreme frustrations with my job plus having a close friend terminate our friendship of 7 years proved to be the triggers to get the depression machine running again. . I told my dr. all that had happened and he told me to immediately raise the dose to 450 mg.,Now I'm just praying that this medication--which I've been hoping would be a a viable alternative to all the other stuff out there--will knock out the depression. The mixed reactions I've read on this board about Moclobemide have me worried that it might not work out. Any (positive!) comments from anyone about Aurorix would be appreciated.
Posted by JohnL on December 29, 2002, at 7:47:11
In reply to Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression, posted by cubbybear on December 29, 2002, at 3:37:29
While surfing around doing research on Moclobemide, there are anecdotal comments from doctors who know this drug well (mostly in Canada) that high doses are often needed, even higher than the highest recommended dose is not unusual. Generally it seems Moclobemide is a good antidepressant, but often only at high doses. And at those high doses, the same kind of side effects you had with SSRIs could probably be expected. Not definitely, but likely.
JohnL
Posted by JonW on December 29, 2002, at 8:58:04
In reply to Re: Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression, posted by JohnL on December 29, 2002, at 7:47:11
>And at those high doses, the same kind of side effects you had with SSRIs could probably be expected. Not definitely, but likely.
I have to respectfully disagree with this. From what I've read and the posts I've seen here I would suspect the only major side-effect to expect would be insomnia. I've been on very high doses of this med and my only complaint was difficulty falling asleep. That's only my subjective experience, but it seems to be very similar to others here. Anyhow, high dose moclobemide is definitely worth a shot. Good luck!
Jon
Posted by SLS on December 29, 2002, at 11:16:29
In reply to Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression, posted by cubbybear on December 29, 2002, at 3:37:29
> Well, unfortunately I had a depressive relapse this week. I had been taking the low dose of 300 mg Aurorix for 3 weeks, and then wham--depression again. But the relapse didn't just come out of the blue: extreme frustrations with my job plus having a close friend terminate our friendship of 7 years proved to be the triggers to get the depression machine running again. . I told my dr. all that had happened and he told me to immediately raise the dose to 450 mg.,Now I'm just praying that this medication--which I've been hoping would be a a viable alternative to all the other stuff out there--will knock out the depression. The mixed reactions I've read on this board about Moclobemide have me worried that it might not work out. Any (positive!) comments from anyone about Aurorix would be appreciated.
Positive:It works for some people and is generally without side effects, even at high dosages. People like it for its lack of sexual side effects.
-
Not so positive:
The problem with moclobemide is that most people need higher and higher dosages to maintain an antidepressant effect - often up to 1200mg. Certainly, one should plan to go up to 900mg. 450mg is generally accepted to be the minimum effective dosage of moclobemide.
Moclobemide is a reversible MAO inhibitor. It is probably accurate to say that reversibility equates to reduced efficacy. Moclobemide is generally weaker than the irreversible MAOIs, Parnate, Nardil, and Marplan.
Of course, there are some people who benefit quite a bit from moclobemide. You won't know until you try. I know your aim is to use it as a prophylactic once you have established a remission with Parnate. You are the first person I have heard of to want to use it this way. I doubt anyone can answer your question with certainty. It might be a valid approach. For now, I wouldn't be bashful about going up to 900mg if you are not experiencing severe side-effects.
Why don't you want to take Parnate?
Good luck with moclobemide. It is worth a try.
- Scott
Posted by bluedog on December 31, 2002, at 18:46:47
In reply to Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression, posted by cubbybear on December 29, 2002, at 3:37:29
> This note is specially intended for bluedog and LyndaK plus anyone else who was following my previous posts about experimenting with Moclobemide (Aurorix) to prevent future depressive relapses. Even if you were not following these posts in Nov.-early Dec., perhaps you have something to say anyway.
> Just to recap: During a period of tranquility after stopping Zoloft, I switched to Aurorix to see if it could PREVENT any depressive relapses in the future .I just wanted to completely get away from the miserable SSRI scene, and had had great results with MAOI Parnate in the past.
> Well, unfortunately I had a depressive relapse this week. I had been taking the low dose of 300 mg Aurorix for 3 weeks, and then wham--depression again. But the relapse didn't just come out of the blue: extreme frustrations with my job plus having a close friend terminate our friendship of 7 years proved to be the triggers to get the depression machine running again. . I told my dr. all that had happened and he told me to immediately raise the dose to 450 mg.,Now I'm just praying that this medication--which I've been hoping would be a a viable alternative to all the other stuff out there--will knock out the depression. The mixed reactions I've read on this board about Moclobemide have me worried that it might not work out. Any (positive!) comments from anyone about Aurorix would be appreciated.HI Cubbybear
It'd now been few days since the increase in your dose but have you noticed any difference in your mood yet? And if your regular Doc appointment is Friday if there has been no effect at 450mg let us know whether he recommends that you try 600mg. Keep thinking as positively as possible under your very difficult circumstances and remember that as I write this message (It's already Wednesday morning where we
both live)it's now only a few more days until your next visit.When I was seriously depressed all those years ago as I descibed in my initial contact with you, 450mg was actually the dose that worked for me.... ALL without any side affects. AS I explained this dose kicked in after about 2-3 weeks. I must add however that the minimum therepeuatic dose of almost any AD Med has always seemed to work for me ......(for those AD meds that I are suited to my own particular system) I just seem to be have a super sensitive system and higher doses than the minimum therapeutic dose generally create problems for me. Having said that because of my current own current depression relapse I am going to discuss upping my Prozac dose to 40mg awhen I next see my own PDOC next week to see if this will give me the little boost I need since my return to work without any causing any further side effect problems.
If your Doc gets you up to 600mg (Which I sincerely hope will not be necessary) please keep me posted as to whether you remain side effect free from the Aurorix (taking into account that a relapse into depression causes it's own unique problems often making it difficult to distinguish between depression symptoms and the med side effects)
AS you can see, I am not the only person posting on this board that is interested in the prophylactic properties of Aurorix or Moclobemide.
Warm regards
bluedog
Posted by cybercafe on December 31, 2002, at 19:22:26
In reply to Re: Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression » cubbybear, posted by bluedog on December 31, 2002, at 18:46:47
>
> If your Doc gets you up to 600mg (Which I sincerely hope will not be necessary) please keep me posted as to whether you remain side effect free from the Aurorix (taking into account that a relapse into depression causes it's own unique problems often making it difficult to distinguish between depression symptoms and the med side effects)
>
> AS you can see, I am not the only person posting on this board that is interested in the prophylactic properties of Aurorix or Moclobemide.
>
> Warm regards
> bluedog
>
>
>i also just got off parnate and am starting to feel depressed, and am considering moclobemide
Posted by cubbybear on January 2, 2003, at 0:26:27
In reply to Re: Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression, posted by cybercafe on December 31, 2002, at 19:22:26
Cybercafe said:
> i also just got off parnate and am starting to feel depressed, and am considering moclobemideWhy did you stop taking the Parnate?--cubbybear
Posted by cybercafe on January 3, 2003, at 0:11:37
In reply to Re: Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression, posted by cubbybear on January 2, 2003, at 0:26:27
>
> Cybercafe said:
> > i also just got off parnate and am starting to feel depressed, and am considering moclobemide
>
> Why did you stop taking the Parnate?--cubbybear
>to take stimulants for ADD
Posted by Ed on January 3, 2003, at 19:01:24
In reply to Re: Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression, posted by cybercafe on January 3, 2003, at 0:11:37
I gotta tell you I like the moclo @ 450 mg. The only other med that ever worked for me was Nardil, but the weight gain was intolerable. Good luck all.
Posted by cubbybear on January 4, 2003, at 3:19:40
In reply to Re: Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression, posted by Ed on January 3, 2003, at 19:01:24
> I gotta tell you I like the moclo @ 450 mg.
Hello Ed,
Do you recall about how long it took for you to get the full anti-depressant effect--2,3,4,?? how many weeks?
Thanks.--cubbybear
Posted by cubbybear on January 4, 2003, at 3:36:04
In reply to Re: Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression » cubbybear, posted by bluedog on December 31, 2002, at 18:46:47
>
> HI bluedog,
You wrote:
>> And if your regular Doc appointment is Friday if there has been no effect at 450mg let us know whether he recommends that you try 600mg.I was feeling just a bit better compared to the week before but he wanted me to increase the dose to 600 mg. anyway, so today (Sat.) was the first day that I did that. So as I write this, it's too soon to know whether I will encounter any side effects. Had none at 450 mg. I'll keep you posted.
You also said:
Having said that because of my current own current depression relapse I am going to discuss upping my Prozac dose to 40mg awhen I next see my own PDOC next week to see if this will give me the little boost I need since my return to work without any causing any further side effect problems.Now, what about you? So, you really did have a relapse right after re-starting work? Tell me how you're doing and if you increased the Prozac dose.
What's the latest?-- cubbybear
P.S. Since my relapse came not very long after yours, I wonder if they can be contagious. ( I have to try and keep my humor amid my torment.)
>
Posted by SLS on January 4, 2003, at 14:04:57
In reply to Re: Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression, posted by cybercafe on January 3, 2003, at 0:11:37
> > > i also just got off parnate and am starting to feel depressed, and am considering moclobemide> > Why did you stop taking the Parnate?--cubbybear
> to take stimulants for ADD
You can take any stimulant with Parnate.Unfortunately, many doctors consider this a lethal combination based upon outdated ideas and misinformation. As with any other treatment with potential side effects, one should titrate such a combination with caution.
I have taken Parnate 120mg + desipramine 300mg + Dexedrine 20mg.
If moclobemide does not produce adequate results, I recommend that you investigate the use of these combinations. You will find stuff about it here in Dr. Bob's Psychopharmacology Tips.
http://www.dr-bob.org/tips/split/MAOIs-in-high-doses-and-wi.html
- Scott
Posted by LyndaK on January 5, 2003, at 2:50:08
In reply to Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression, posted by cubbybear on December 29, 2002, at 3:37:29
Hi Steve,
Sorry I took so long to respond. Haven't been on the computer for a while. Sorry to hear that things are not so well. Sounds like you're starting to respond to the increase in your dose though.
I'm sure you've considered this but I'll say it anyways, I think feeling depressed is a very normal response to a personal loss -- and relationships/friendships are about as personal as it gets. I also know the fear (terror) that those depressed feelings are going to turn into the unrelenting kind of depression that is so very difficult to pull out of. I think increasing your dose is a wise thing to do -- and maybe a more appropriate dose anyways based on what others have said here. But don't be afraid of your grief either. Be with it. Get close to it. Spend some time reflecting on it. Talk about it. And trust that you're going to come out the other side -- maybe knowing something you didn't know before, or understanding something you didn't understand before, or maybe still just being totally bewildered about it -- but trust that you'll come out the other side.
This probably isn't a very good PB post since I only said about 2 sentences about meds. Oh well.
Keep on keepin' on!
Lynda
Posted by MARKED on January 17, 2004, at 13:05:56
In reply to Re: Moclobemide (Aurorix) to Prevent Depression » cybercafe, posted by SLS on January 4, 2003, at 14:04:57
I've found moclobemide to be the most useful in neutralising depressive seasons. Very minimal side-effects, the least noticable of many i've tried. Dosage was up to 850mg for me....used for 2 years (then weaned off, to go on my own). Good mood stabiliser..., I probably felt more manic than depressed on aurorix. Relapsed a few times.......now i find i'm able to deal with depression better with support group (extenstion of CBT classes). Alternative measures, non-presciptives. But feel i'm more bipolar again, with lathargic lack of energy and low emotionless moods. Not really depressed, but not happy even when i should/know i am. Cycling in moods 2-3 times a day for 3 days, then 3 days off. Not excessively manic, but definatley still trying to achieve that content feeling (which i haven't had in years), longest it lasts is a week max (this is with no medication i might add).
I'm looking at combining Moclobemide with another mood stabiliser, amino acids, etc.
Any suggestions welcome....
This is the end of the thread.
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