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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by alex01 on April 25, 2002, at 6:30:24
Hi
seeking advice on my reaction to a tiny dose of dexamphetamine taken 8 months ago. A couple of pdocs have described me as biploar 2, up and down but not psychotic. Before this one doc thought i had ADD and I tried a small dose of dex. I had an enormous rush and my head "filled up" or was very energised and aroused. It wasnt a panic attack, although i was scared, I couldn't think, and my vision went funny, things seemed to be moving (but not really halucinating). I didn't have racing thoughts (as i used to have when agitated) I had no thoughts just an overwhelming tense, blank, hyper arounsed feeling. I felt very distant from the world. It hasnt stopped my getting a bit hyper here and there but has blocked off all depression that I used to have although it is still pretty scary.
Anyway, problem is that after 8 months and no more dex, I am still getting that reaction a couple of times a day, although the rushes are less scary, just very uncomfortable.
I have tried Zyprexa, Epilim and beta blockers. The beta blockers have been the best but perhaps thay only make me less scared.
I went to a neurologist who said he had heard of this happening to someone who took dex and it took a year to go away. My eeg scan came up as abnormal which made him think that it could be seizure activty, but given that i tried epilim and it didnt work that it probably wasnt.
Desperate for any advice or if anyone has heard of something like this. I have seen people refer to kindling and thought maybe it was something like that.
any advice eagerly received.
Alex
Posted by Ritch on April 25, 2002, at 12:30:04
In reply to Bipolar Dexamphetamine reaction - kindling?, posted by alex01 on April 25, 2002, at 6:30:24
> Hi
>
> seeking advice on my reaction to a tiny dose of dexamphetamine taken 8 months ago. A couple of pdocs have described me as biploar 2, up and down but not psychotic. Before this one doc thought i had ADD and I tried a small dose of dex. I had an enormous rush and my head "filled up" or was very energised and aroused. It wasnt a panic attack, although i was scared, I couldn't think, and my vision went funny, things seemed to be moving (but not really halucinating). I didn't have racing thoughts (as i used to have when agitated) I had no thoughts just an overwhelming tense, blank, hyper arounsed feeling. I felt very distant from the world. It hasnt stopped my getting a bit hyper here and there but has blocked off all depression that I used to have although it is still pretty scary.
>
> Anyway, problem is that after 8 months and no more dex, I am still getting that reaction a couple of times a day, although the rushes are less scary, just very uncomfortable.
>
> I have tried Zyprexa, Epilim and beta blockers. The beta blockers have been the best but perhaps thay only make me less scared.
>
> I went to a neurologist who said he had heard of this happening to someone who took dex and it took a year to go away. My eeg scan came up as abnormal which made him think that it could be seizure activty, but given that i tried epilim and it didnt work that it probably wasnt.
>
> Desperate for any advice or if anyone has heard of something like this. I have seen people refer to kindling and thought maybe it was something like that.
>
> any advice eagerly received.
>
> Alex
Hi Alex,I think I remember your original posts about that. It sounds like a derealization or depersonalization disorder, just a hunch. There are some meds that have had success with that which you might try: Zoloft, Lamictal, Klonopin, Topamax. If you *have* an abnormal EEG, you probably should get it investigated a little more thoroughly. If you have taken just one anticonvulsant and it didn't work-that doesn't mean a whole lot. There are people that have quite observable-obvious seizures that only *certain* anticonvulsants work properly for them.
hope this helps,
Mitch
Posted by katekite on April 25, 2002, at 17:30:44
In reply to Bipolar Dexamphetamine reaction - kindling?, posted by alex01 on April 25, 2002, at 6:30:24
I don't know that no response to epilim would mean it wouldn't respond to some anti-epileptic like depakote or neurontin. But maybe you are on one or more AED for your bpII?
Is there any chance it is a dissociative experience? Where things feel not quite real, more distant than normal?
kate
Posted by alex01 on April 26, 2002, at 10:08:15
In reply to Re: Bipolar Dexamphetamine reaction - kindling?, posted by katekite on April 25, 2002, at 17:30:44
Ritch and Kate (and anyone else)
very helpful thankyou, yes I have posted before, many months ago unfortunately with the same prob.I've never heard of the terms that you both used, the d... words in the title. It certainly feels like the world is distant when I am having these "rushes", it is a sort of sensory thing, I don't "take things in" and don't feel "present".Grateful any brief explanation of what they mean and how to stop them.
Also possibly some seizure activity, will need to discuss this more with doc. The neurologist said that the abnormal either means 1. nothing at all 2. effects of medication 3. seizure activity. Not particularly helpful.
The scariest thing about this is that the docs I have seen are clearly just guessing. Still I suppose that's the best anyone can do at this stage.
Thank you for your advice and support
Posted by katekite on April 26, 2002, at 11:54:43
In reply to Re:dissociative, derealisation, depersonalisation?, posted by alex01 on April 26, 2002, at 10:08:15
I copied this off somewhere. Here it's described as its own disorder, but moments like this can be a feature of other problems, I think.
The difference between depersonalization and derealization is that in the former you think the world is the same but you are different, and in the latter you are the same but the world is different: they can co-exist.
Dissociative is a general term referring to either depersonalization, derealization or both. (In this case its a different use of the term than when it is used as 'dissociative identity disorder' more commonly known as multiple personality disorder.)
hope this helps -- kate
----
Depersonalization Disorder (300.60): The essential feature is the occurrence of one or more episodes of depersonalization that cause social or occupational impairment.
The symptom of depersonalization involves an alteration in the perception or experience of the self so that the usual sense of one's own reality is temporarily lost or changed. This is manifested by a sensation of self-estrangement or unreality, which may include the feeling that one's extremities have changed in size, or the experience of seeming to perceive oneself from a distance. In addition, the individual may feel "mechanical" or as though in a dream. Various types of sensory anesthesia and feeling of not being in complete control of one's actions, including speech, are often present.
Associated features: Derealization is frequently present. This is manifested by a strange alteration in the perception of one's surroundings so that a sense of the reality of the external world is lost. A perceived change in the size of shape of objects in the external world is common. People may be perceived as dead or mechanical.
Other common associated features include dizziness, depression, obsessive ruminations, anxiety, fear of going insane, and disturbance in the subjective sense of time. There is often the feeling that recall is difficult or slow.
Posted by judy1 on April 29, 2002, at 23:47:24
In reply to Re:dissociative, derealisation, depersonalisation?, posted by alex01 on April 26, 2002, at 10:08:15
Hi Alex,
The best advice I can give is to see an epileptologist to have more thorough testing done- EEG's really don't tell much. My specialist wanted me in the hospital for a week so they could hook me up with naso-pharyngeal (sp) leads for an EEG and keep visual observations. I've had seizures in the past, am diagnosed DD- NOS which often mimics TLE and also bipolar and panic disorders. These all involve kindling so nothing is clearcut- the key is to be treated with the correct medication and therapy to stop symptoms. I say therapy because some of my dissociative experiences are a result of abuse. I've had PET and MRI scans that show a smaller left hippocampus, so there is organic problems too. Just make sure your neuro and shrink are communicating with each other and I'm sure you'll start to find answers. Take care, Judy
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