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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 1 to 10 of 10. This is the beginning of the thread.
Posted by misty99 on February 23, 2002, at 8:55:20
I was wondering if anyone else has experienced this? I started a regular exercise program in addition to taking my meds because I want to do everything possible to help myself. Currently I am taking St. John's Wort, Adderall, and Remeron at night. The Adderall I take three times a day and I had been taking St. Johns Wort in the morning all at once because I have been having difficulties with insomnia.
I have consistently walked outside for about 15-20 minutes right before lunch and my next Adderall dose. Last week, it seemed like early afternoon, I started feeling agiatated as it just seemed like my body had used up the St. Johns Wort. Taking an additional amount didn't help and actually made the situation worse.
Yesterday, I thought I would try adding 150mg to the morning St. Johns Wort dose and the same thing happened in the afternoon after I had walked in the morning. Because of what happens, my mood sinks in the afternoon and I end up not being able to sleep.
Today, I will try the strategy of spreading the dose out to see if that helps before I bag St. Johns Wort and go on to another antidepressant. It's very discouraging because I feel I am being the good patient and doing what I am suppose to do and it just seems like I am feeling worse. I do know I am getting some benefits from exercising so I try to keep that in mind but it's hard.
I know there was an earlier thread last year? that seemed to be somewhat similar where someone said after exercising, he felt that a chemist was was rearraning the chemicals in his brain. But other than that, I have seen nothing that even comes close to mentioning the problems I am having which makes me feel even worse because there just doesn't seem to be an answer for what is going on. By the way, the medication works great until I get that affect in the afternoon.
If anyone has any insights or has heard of anything similar, I would greatly appreciate it.
Misty
Posted by JohnX2 on February 23, 2002, at 14:24:54
In reply to Am I the only person this happens to?, posted by misty99 on February 23, 2002, at 8:55:20
I wouldn't feel comfortable mixing SJW with
Adderall and Remeron. I believe taking the standalone
"Kira" Brand of SJW is reputable if you want to go that route.
Other brands of SJW may not have good quality control.Good luck.
John
> I was wondering if anyone else has experienced this? I started a regular exercise program in addition to taking my meds because I want to do everything possible to help myself. Currently I am taking St. John's Wort, Adderall, and Remeron at night. The Adderall I take three times a day and I had been taking St. Johns Wort in the morning all at once because I have been having difficulties with insomnia.
>
> I have consistently walked outside for about 15-20 minutes right before lunch and my next Adderall dose. Last week, it seemed like early afternoon, I started feeling agiatated as it just seemed like my body had used up the St. Johns Wort. Taking an additional amount didn't help and actually made the situation worse.
>
> Yesterday, I thought I would try adding 150mg to the morning St. Johns Wort dose and the same thing happened in the afternoon after I had walked in the morning. Because of what happens, my mood sinks in the afternoon and I end up not being able to sleep.
>
> Today, I will try the strategy of spreading the dose out to see if that helps before I bag St. Johns Wort and go on to another antidepressant. It's very discouraging because I feel I am being the good patient and doing what I am suppose to do and it just seems like I am feeling worse. I do know I am getting some benefits from exercising so I try to keep that in mind but it's hard.
>
> I know there was an earlier thread last year? that seemed to be somewhat similar where someone said after exercising, he felt that a chemist was was rearraning the chemicals in his brain. But other than that, I have seen nothing that even comes close to mentioning the problems I am having which makes me feel even worse because there just doesn't seem to be an answer for what is going on. By the way, the medication works great until I get that affect in the afternoon.
>
> If anyone has any insights or has heard of anything similar, I would greatly appreciate it.
>
> Misty
Posted by misty99 on February 23, 2002, at 19:49:55
In reply to Re: Am I the only person this happens to? » misty99, posted by JohnX2 on February 23, 2002, at 14:24:54
>
> I wouldn't feel comfortable mixing SJW with
> Adderall and Remeron. I believe taking the standalone
> "Kira" Brand of SJW is reputable if you want to go that route.John,
Thanks for your response. When I switched over to St. Johns Wort last year, I did extensive research and didn't see any information that taking it with Remeron and Adderall was contraindicated. Since my psychiatrist hasn't had any problems with the combination, I am curious as to why you make that statement.
As an FYI, the Safeway Select Brand received a higher rating than the Kira Brand when the LA Times did some research in 98. I have had the exact same result with it as Kira, when it works, it's great and when it fizzles out, it's horrible.
Of course, everybody is different and when someone asks my advice about St. Johns Wort, I tell them also to stick with Kira. But that doesn't mean that other brands can't work because they do.Another reason why I think the LA Times results have some validity even though they were done in 98 is that they reported for a brand that I was previously taking, Nature's Resource, has 149% of the hypercin that it claims to have. Interestingly, I was having insomnia on 450mg whereas I have taken 600mg with Kira and Safeway Select and didn't have any problems. Even my psychiatrist who doesn't get readily impressed by statistics that I quote found that interesting.
Now to the issue I raised. I tried spreading out the dose today and feel alot better. Hopefully, I'll sleep ok and of course, I need to see if this strategy continues to work. Now that I think about it, my problems have nothing to do with exercise as this was happening when I wasn't exercising which was with the Kira Brand I might add.
Anyway, John, I would be interested in any research you show that indicates I should not be taking SJW with Remeron and Adderall because I never found anything and my psychiatrist hasn't voiced any objections to the combination.
Misty
Posted by misty99 on February 23, 2002, at 20:01:27
In reply to Re: Am I the only person this happens to? » misty99, posted by JohnX2 on February 23, 2002, at 14:24:54
>
> I wouldn't feel comfortable mixing SJW with
> Adderall and Remeron. I believe taking the standalone
> "Kira" Brand of SJW is reputable if you want to go that route.John,
Thanks for your response. When I switched over to St. Johns Wort last year, I did extensive research and didn't see any information that taking it with Remeron and Adderall was contraindicated. Since my psychiatrist hasn't had any problems with the combination, I am curious as to why you make that statement.
As an FYI, the Safeway Select Brand received a higher rating than the Kira Brand when the LA Times did some research in 98. I have had the exact same result with it as Kira, when it works, it's great and when it fizzles out, it's horrible.
Of course, everybody is different and when someone asks my advice about St. Johns Wort, I tell them also to stick with Kira. But that doesn't mean that other brands can't work because they do.Another reason why I think the LA Times results have some validity even though they were done in 98 is that they reported for a brand that I was previously taking, Nature's Resource, has 149% of the hypercin that it claims to have. Interestingly, I was having insomnia on 450mg whereas I have taken 600mg with Kira and Safeway Select and didn't have any problems. Even my psychiatrist who doesn't get readily impressed by statistics that I quote found that interesting.
Now to the issue I raised. I tried spreading out the dose today and feel alot better. Hopefully, I'll sleep ok and of course, I need to see if this strategy continues to work. Now that I think about it, my problems have nothing to do with exercise as this was happening when I wasn't exercising which was with the Kira Brand I might add.
Anyway, John, I would be interested in any research you show that indicates I should not be taking SJW with Remeron and Adderall because I never found anything and my psychiatrist hasn't voiced any objections to the combination.
Misty
Posted by JohnX2 on February 25, 2002, at 21:09:29
In reply to Re: Am I the only person this happens to?, posted by misty99 on February 23, 2002, at 19:49:55
Misty,I'm glad to hear that you have had the chance to research
the reputable brands of SJW. I personally found it to be
one of the most tolerable ADs and i got just as good an
AD response as any other except Lamictal. The medicine
is extremely well excepted in Germany, particularly the
variant used in the Kira brand. . If it is working good for you then I say
best to you. I feel that SJW is a pretty safe medicine. I
was just wondering if there were a lot of clinical evidence
showing it was safe to mix with other ADs long term. Just thinking
about your safety.Best of luck,
John
> >
> > I wouldn't feel comfortable mixing SJW with
> > Adderall and Remeron. I believe taking the standalone
> > "Kira" Brand of SJW is reputable if you want to go that route.
>
> John,
>
> Thanks for your response. When I switched over to St. Johns Wort last year, I did extensive research and didn't see any information that taking it with Remeron and Adderall was contraindicated. Since my psychiatrist hasn't had any problems with the combination, I am curious as to why you make that statement.
>
> As an FYI, the Safeway Select Brand received a higher rating than the Kira Brand when the LA Times did some research in 98. I have had the exact same result with it as Kira, when it works, it's great and when it fizzles out, it's horrible.
> Of course, everybody is different and when someone asks my advice about St. Johns Wort, I tell them also to stick with Kira. But that doesn't mean that other brands can't work because they do.
>
> Another reason why I think the LA Times results have some validity even though they were done in 98 is that they reported for a brand that I was previously taking, Nature's Resource, has 149% of the hypercin that it claims to have. Interestingly, I was having insomnia on 450mg whereas I have taken 600mg with Kira and Safeway Select and didn't have any problems. Even my psychiatrist who doesn't get readily impressed by statistics that I quote found that interesting.
>
> Now to the issue I raised. I tried spreading out the dose today and feel alot better. Hopefully, I'll sleep ok and of course, I need to see if this strategy continues to work. Now that I think about it, my problems have nothing to do with exercise as this was happening when I wasn't exercising which was with the Kira Brand I might add.
>
> Anyway, John, I would be interested in any research you show that indicates I should not be taking SJW with Remeron and Adderall because I never found anything and my psychiatrist hasn't voiced any objections to the combination.
>
> Misty
Posted by misty99 on February 26, 2002, at 8:32:16
In reply to Re: Am I the only person this happens to? » misty99, posted by JohnX2 on February 25, 2002, at 21:09:29
Thanks John, I appreciate your concerns and that's what makes this board so great because of people like you. Unfortunately, the issue is about to become moot because 600mg SJW is not enough and anything over that is too much. This is getting to be the story of my life with these antidepressants as the same thing happened with Prozac <sigh>. I wish I could just chuck these AD's but I know from personal experience that I can't be without one. So it's pick my poison time.
Sorry, I am in a bad mood as I am trying to fix Microsoft Office as well as deal with the med issue.
Misty
Posted by JohnX2 on February 26, 2002, at 16:26:57
In reply to Re: Am I the only person this happens to?, posted by misty99 on February 26, 2002, at 8:32:16
> Sorry, I am in a bad mood as I am trying to fix Microsoft Office as well as deal with the med issue.LOL. I sympathize. I work in the computer business (chip design).
My sister called me on the phone last night crying her eyes out
because she was having so many problems with her computer after
trying to install Microsoft Windows XP. I spent about an hour trying
to calm her down and tell her it wasn't the end of the world.
Put my depression into a new perspective.Good luck.
-John
Posted by pedr on February 27, 2002, at 7:34:44
In reply to Am I the only person this happens to?, posted by misty99 on February 23, 2002, at 8:55:20
> I was wondering if anyone else has experienced this? I started a regular exercise program in addition to taking my meds because I want to do everything possible to help myself. Currently I am taking St. John's Wort, Adderall, and Remeron at night. The Adderall I take three times a day and I had been taking St. Johns Wort in the morning all at once because I have been having difficulties with insomnia.
>
> I have consistently walked outside for about 15-20 minutes right before lunch and my next Adderall dose. Last week, it seemed like early afternoon, I started feeling agiatated as it just seemed like my body had used up the St. Johns Wort. Taking an additional amount didn't help and actually made the situation worse.
>
> Yesterday, I thought I would try adding 150mg to the morning St. Johns Wort dose and the same thing happened in the afternoon after I had walked in the morning. Because of what happens, my mood sinks in the afternoon and I end up not being able to sleep.
>
> Today, I will try the strategy of spreading the dose out to see if that helps before I bag St. Johns Wort and go on to another antidepressant. It's very discouraging because I feel I am being the good patient and doing what I am suppose to do and it just seems like I am feeling worse. I do know I am getting some benefits from exercising so I try to keep that in mind but it's hard.
>
> I know there was an earlier thread last year? that seemed to be somewhat similar where someone said after exercising, he felt that a chemist was was rearraning the chemicals in his brain. But other than that, I have seen nothing that even comes close to mentioning the problems I am having which makes me feel even worse because there just doesn't seem to be an answer for what is going on. By the way, the medication works great until I get that affect in the afternoon.
>
> If anyone has any insights or has heard of anything similar, I would greatly appreciate it.
>
> MistyHi Misty,
in terms of looking for an answer as to why your mood swings down when it does, that is something I find myself often asking. My mood will suddenly plummet without any causal thinking that I can detect. I am sometimes able to link resultant low moods/anxiety to depressed thinking I've just done but this isn't always the case.
For some dives in mood I don't think there is a viable explanation and often, trying too hard to work it out and obsessing over it can make things worse.
I've asked my shrink about these sudden dives in mood and we concluded that the only viable scenarios are:
1. there is no causal thought and the mood swings are "biological" in nature. This would imply that a change in dose/drug might be in order.
2. there is a causal thinking pattern but I can't detect it. I guess the only thing that can be done here is to maintain focused effort on detecting and challenging this thought pattern.
As for exercise, I find it helps briefly in that the 1/2 hr afterwards I feel better but that's about it. It certainly doesn't last for me.
Sorry I haven't been much assistance but I just wanted you to know that you're certainly not the only person out there who doesn't know why their mood swings down so horribly and inexplicably.Best wishes,
pete
Posted by misty99 on February 27, 2002, at 9:27:46
In reply to Re: Am I the only person this happens to?, posted by pedr on February 27, 2002, at 7:34:44
> Sorry I haven't been much assistance but I just wanted you to know that you're certainly not the only person out there who doesn't know why their mood swings down so horribly and inexplicably.
>
Pete,You have been helpful as you let me know I am not the only one with the problems I described. I am changing over to Luvox since Zoloft worked well in the past before fizzling out. I didn't have much success with Prozac and Celexa was a disaster. Hard to say on Serzone since I took it when I was severely depressed.
I remember responding quickly to Paxil but because at the time, I was a medication newbie, I didn't stay with it when I should have. But the weight gain it can cause scares the dickens out of me.
Anyway, I feel because of my PMS and somewhat success with SSRI's, I should go with the Luvox. I think I shocked my psychiatrist because I vowed I would never touch another SSRI but it just seems like the logical thing to do.
I think what happens to me no matter what medication I am on is if I do the things that experts say I should do and the problem seems to get worst, it throws me for a loop. It's like darn, I did what I am suppose to do and the problem is getting worst.
But as I said earlier in one of my posts, I don't think exercise had anything to do with this as it was not meant to be for the SJW to work.
Good luck with your own situation.
Misty
Posted by misty99 on February 27, 2002, at 9:38:32
In reply to Re: Am I the only person this happens to? » misty99, posted by JohnX2 on February 26, 2002, at 16:26:57
>
>
> LOL. I sympathize. I work in the computer business (chip design).
> My sister called me on the phone last night crying her eyes out
> because she was having so many problems with her computer after
> trying to install Microsoft Windows XP.John,
Believe me, I feel your sister's pain as I alternated between crying and curse words. I am still having problems with "System Restore" on Windows ME so if my med problems prevent me from fixing it, can I contact you:))?
Don't you love the way I keep this on topic so it doesn't get redirected to the social board:))?
In all seriousness, I belong to a local computer group so if I really need to, I can contact them. I was just trying to joke around as I feel humor helps us get through these tough situations.
Misty
PS - I did get Office 2000 working again, thankfully.
This is the end of the thread.
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