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Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
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Posted by fires on July 16, 2004, at 23:53:07
In reply to Re: one small step for me, posted by JenStar on July 16, 2004, at 20:54:01
It's quite sad. If some Drs only knew the suffering they have caused by misdiagnosing.
Glad your friend is now cancer free. My brother past away about 1 month ago from esophageal cancer. He fought against a no win situation for 4 and a half years.
I noticed you are now JenStar rather than Texas Chic. I'm just curious why?
Best
Posted by shadows721 on July 18, 2004, at 20:02:53
In reply to one small step for me, posted by fires on July 16, 2004, at 10:49:17
"I've stated her before that therapy in the past did little for my Dep.. " How much feelings did you allow to be expressed in therapy?
Somatization is another psychic defense mechanism, another way of NOT FEELING FEELINGS. It is expressed by our anger against ourselves, or trying to control others, making others feel inadequate.
Posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 21:12:58
In reply to Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by shadows721 on July 18, 2004, at 20:02:53
I realize that is your opinion. I don't share it.
I believe Somatoform Disorder is often used by Docs who can't find what is really wrong with a patient. It's a wastebasket for disorders of unknown cause.
The history of medicine helps confirm my belief:
Autism was believed to be due to "cold mothering."
Schizophrenia and other biopsych. disorders were due to "demonic possession."
TB was due to "an overactive creative spirit."
Parkinson's Disease was the result of "conflict between an aggressive drive to action and an equally strong internal pressure to inhibition."
The NEJM not too many years ago included an editorial which stated: "It is time to acknowledge that our belief in disease as a direct reflection of mental state is largely folklore."
Need more examples?: Fibromyalgia, MS, Ulcers, Alzheimer's, stuttering, bed wetting, etc...
You seem intent on making everything due to "feelings". Correct?
Posted by Dinah on July 18, 2004, at 21:26:40
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 21:12:58
Do you by any chance think the school of psychiatry should be merged into or replaced by neurology?
If so, you might want to do an archive search. I think you'll meet a soulmate that way.
(Meds board, I think)
Posted by shadows721 on July 18, 2004, at 22:03:47
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 21:12:58
"You seem intent on making everything due to "feelings". Correct?"
Answer: Some depressed people overuse certain psychological defense mechanisms --denial, isolation, and repression, --to help keep "feelings" out of conscious awareness. Defenses help protect our conscious minds from awareness that underneath, we are in conflict with ourselves. When reality is too much to be accepted--a family member gets murdered--we can go into denial. Defense mechanisms are necessary for dealing with difficult situations or people. But, they can be used by people with depression as a way to AVOID feelings. A person can become so hypertrophied, that they lose their ability to feel altogether. This explains why the body will take on the feelings the person refuses to deal with. Hence, the person develops a Somatization Disorder to express what is not being expressed in with the conscious mind.
Furthermore, when we don't feel bad things. We will not feel good things either. We become numb to our feelings and to other feelings. The effects are enormous. So, how is it so beneficial to *not* feel?
Sorry, Fires, I didn't understand the relevance of your comparing my explanation of Somatization Disorder and those other conditions. Help explain, please?
Thank you.
Posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:37:23
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings » fires, posted by Dinah on July 18, 2004, at 21:26:40
I'd prefer that you just tell me the name of my "soulmate." :) or post a link to thread.
Posted by Dinah on July 18, 2004, at 22:40:31
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:37:23
But that would take away the mystery. :) If you can't find it in a week or so, I'll give you a hint - depending of course on the answer to the question:
So, do you think psychiatry should be merged into or replaced by neurology?
(because otherwise it would be moot)
You don't have to answer of course. I just wasn't sure whether to interpret your response to me as a yes.
Posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:40:58
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by shadows721 on July 18, 2004, at 22:03:47
Sorry to have to inform you, but 99.99% of everything you wrote is in my opinion either : 1)pure fiction or 2) unprovable or 3) complete **
That's all.
Posted by gardenergirl on July 18, 2004, at 22:42:23
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:40:58
> Sorry to have to inform you
Really?
gg
Posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:54:58
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings » fires, posted by Dinah on July 18, 2004, at 22:40:31
Hmm, something smells fishy, but I'll bite anyway. Yes, I think psychiatry should be merged with neurology, OR "mental illnesses" could be renamed "brain disorders."
Posted by shadows721 on July 18, 2004, at 22:55:05
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:40:58
"Sorry to have to inform you, but 99.99% of everything you wrote is in my opinion either : 1)pure fiction or 2) unprovable or 3) complete **"
Please explain. I don't understand your comment.
Thank you.
Posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:55:59
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings » fires, posted by gardenergirl on July 18, 2004, at 22:42:23
No, not really. It's a figure of speech.
Posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:59:05
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by shadows721 on July 18, 2004, at 22:55:05
Nope. As they say in video arcades , "game over."
Too many tilts. And, to hard to figure out who's on first. ;) I'm not a fool.
Posted by gardenergirl on July 18, 2004, at 23:00:17
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:55:59
Posted by Dinah on July 18, 2004, at 23:15:23
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:54:58
Nothing fishy, fires. You just remind me an awful lot of an old poster. And I think it would be more fun for you to find him yourself and see if you feel a certain kinship. So try typing in merging psychiatry and neurology into the search engine. It should come up with some hits. You could even use the Babble search I think. Meds board.
Or you can just forget the whole thing. But I think you'd really enjoy those posts.
Posted by shadows721 on July 18, 2004, at 23:19:43
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:59:05
"Nope. As they say in video arcades , "game over."
Too many tilts. And, to hard to figure out who's on first. ;) I'm not a fool."
What does this mean?
Posted by Dr. Bob on July 19, 2004, at 0:32:59
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:40:58
> 99.99% of everything you wrote is in my opinion either : 1)pure fiction or 2) unprovable or 3) complete **
Please don't post anything that could lead others to feel put down.
If you have any questions or comments about this or about posting policies in general, or are interested in alternative ways of expressing yourself, please see the FAQ:
http://www.dr-bob.org/babble/faq.html#civil
or redirect a follow-up to Psycho-Babble Administration.
Thanks,
Bob
Posted by JenStar on July 19, 2004, at 0:42:09
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by fires on July 18, 2004, at 22:59:05
Fires,
Your posts seem to be a bit defensive. Are you feeling paranoid about anything here? Or am I just imagining this?JenStar (not TexasChic, although that IS a cool name too - smile)
Posted by TexasChic on July 19, 2004, at 8:26:24
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by JenStar on July 19, 2004, at 0:42:09
Thanks (about the name). I really couldn't think of anything else when I came up with it.
I'm not sure why fires thinks we're the same person. We must have similar writing styles.
I'm also glad you friend is cancer free. That's terrible that they didn't believe her at first. Doctors do seem to be especially skeptical of female problems. I guess because it varies so much from woman to woman. They're better now than they used to be though. Back in the 80's, when I was a teenager, everytime I started my period I would throw up for two straight days from the pain. The doctor just prescribed Vitamin B (like that's going to help!). I sometimes wonder now if that could have been a contributor to my depression. At least they acknowledge it exists now. Not that that helps if your doc doesn't believe you!
T
Posted by TexasChic on July 19, 2004, at 15:57:32
In reply to Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by shadows721 on July 18, 2004, at 20:02:53
> Somatization is another psychic defense mechanism, another way of NOT FEELING FEELINGS. It is expressed by our anger against ourselves, or trying to control others, making others feel inadequate. >
Call me ditzy (everyone else does) but I don't really understand what you're trying to say here. The definition I read for somatization was this: Physical symptoms that seem as if they are part of a general medical condition, however no general medical condition, other mental disorder, or substance is present. Are you saying that people with this disorder think they're sick because they aren't able to express their feelings any other way? That kind of makes sense. I'm just curious.
Also, I think fires was talking about being falsely accused of having it.
Posted by Jai Narayan on July 19, 2004, at 22:19:37
In reply to Re: Somatization -psychic defense against feelings, posted by shadows721 on July 18, 2004, at 22:55:05
I love your questions and your sincerity.
This poster seems to be unable to answer your questions.
but have no fear your questions are greatly appreciated.
I care.
Posted by shadows721 on July 20, 2004, at 0:14:05
In reply to Dear Shadows, posted by Jai Narayan on July 19, 2004, at 22:19:37
Thank you so much, Jai Narayan. You have no idea how much your post means to me. I really appreciate your kind words. You really touched my heart when I needed it.
Posted by fires on July 20, 2004, at 13:27:20
In reply to Dear Shadows, posted by Jai Narayan on July 19, 2004, at 22:19:37
Nice try.
Posted by Dinah on July 20, 2004, at 13:48:05
In reply to Re: Dear Shadows, posted by fires on July 20, 2004, at 13:27:20
I believe Jai was being sincere. You have many champions on this board. If you open your heart to them you might be pleasantly surprised.
It's your choice of course. I understand that you might feel you have been burned both here and on other boards when you try to help others. But there are many people here who honestly want to be your friend. Others who might not. But if you don't take the risk, you'll miss the reward of caring support.
Posted by AuntieMel on July 21, 2004, at 10:11:40
In reply to Re: Dear Shadows, posted by fires on July 20, 2004, at 13:27:20
I'm one of the champions. We all need to take a step back and take a deep breath.
I realize that you have had a long history of really bad experiences with therapy and this affects your opinion of therapy as a whole, but:
The 99% statememt could be taken as an invalidation of other peoples treatments. They are doing what they think is right for them and thats a good thing in my book.
So, instead of making what seemed to me (and others) as a blanket harsh statement, maybe a bit more about how you came to that opinion (personal experience) would make it come across a bit better.
Glad you're back
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