![[dr. bob]](/dr-bob-sm.gif)
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.orgShown: posts 27 to 51 of 56. Go back in thread:
Posted by SLS on August 25, 2000, at 8:01:28
In reply to Re: Serzone and MDMA, posted by stjames on August 24, 2000, at 22:19:25
> If you have the title of this paper, send it on, please. I would like to pass it to
> the MAPS list and watch the PhD's discuss it.
>
> james
Hi James.What is the MAPS list?
- Scott
Posted by Big Mike on August 25, 2000, at 11:08:06
In reply to Re: Serzone and MDMA, posted by Dixon on August 24, 2000, at 11:34:58
But if MDMA did cause permanent/temporary damage...what would it damage and would an SSRI work to restore what was damaged, and if so, how does this work????
Posted by CraigF on August 25, 2000, at 12:30:47
In reply to Re: Serzone and MDMA, posted by Big Mike on August 25, 2000, at 11:08:06
I know this isn't terribly scientific or anything, but my doc told me after reading recent studies that the brain repairs the receptors eventually, but they grow back shorter, and in a different position. This lessens their effectiveness and can eventually lower the efficacy of AD's.
He added, however, that some people seem fairly immune to the effects of E while some psyches can't handle it well at all. Unfortunately, I fall into the latter category.
Posted by stjames on August 25, 2000, at 12:53:09
In reply to Re: Serzone and MDMA, posted by SLS on August 25, 2000, at 8:01:28
>
> Hi James.
>
> What is the MAPS list?
>
>
> - Scott"The Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies (MAPS) is a membership-based non-profit research and educational organization. We assist scientists to design, fund, obtain approval for and report on studies into the healing and spiritual potentials of MDMA, psychedelic drugs and marijuana. "
Posted by cd on September 2, 2000, at 20:47:05
In reply to Re: Serzone and MDMA, posted by stjames on August 25, 2000, at 12:53:09
Just for the sake of putting the toxicity of MDMA into perspective,
search for its structure on the web and do the same for Paxil.
Compare the two and the similarity jumps at you.
Hmmm wonder where they came up with the idea for Paxil.
Attach MDMA to another molecule to slow its effects and you have your new wonder dug.
Anectdotal evidence from people I know who have taken Paxil and MDMA in various combinations,
that is together, one before the other, after washout periods etc..
would seem to point to an accelerated removal of MDMA from the body after exposure to Paxil.
Perhaps the body is just used to chewing up the MDMA molecule after daily exposure to a similar item through Paxil?
As things stand, no one says long term Paxil
or short term rare MDMA exposure is going to cause major irreversible damage.
Posted by noa on September 4, 2000, at 13:03:52
In reply to Re: Serzone and MDMA, posted by cd on September 2, 2000, at 20:47:05
A major difference that is very important is that with prescription medications, the potency and volume is standardized and reliable. With street drugs, you never know what and how much and how strong.
Posted by Ryan P. on October 30, 2000, at 10:35:39
In reply to Re: Serzone and MDMA, posted by Bons on May 22, 2000, at 22:48:12
> From what I understand serzone is an SSRI and inhibits the effects of X, my advice if you really want to try it, lay off the serzone for a week, that is what my friends have done in the past. Apparently the X wont really work at all if you take it while taking serzone. I am not saying this is the best idea in the world, but if your set on trying X at least enjoy it.
I would have to agree. I'm 22 years old, and I started taking X two years ago. While I was once taking up to two pills a week, I am currently taking X only once or twice a month. I was also recently prescribed Serzone for social anxiety. I started taking it about 7 weeks ago, and am up to 500 mg/day (possibly will take more). The last two times I've taken X (both within the last 7 weeks), I've had very minimal "rolling" effects from X. It is my understanding that Prozac has been proven to prevent the effectiveness of X, but I had not heard that about other anti-depressants. Is there an anti-depressant that will not limit the effectiveness of X? I'm beginning to feel like doing X now is just a waste of money. And probably isn't helping the anti-depressant do its job very well.
Posted by CraigF on October 31, 2000, at 7:55:21
In reply to Re: Serzone and MDMA, posted by Ryan P. on October 30, 2000, at 10:35:39
Not only that, but by taking ecstacy you are destroying your brain's ability to maintain a good mood, free of anxiety. Ask your doctor.
I'm not being sanctimonious, I'm 28 myself and all my friends roll. I had to stop because it affects my moods too much in the long run.
The choice is yours, but make sure you know what it is doing to your brain. Find out from your doctor, not Time magazine, not a DARE poster.
Posted by Ryan P. on November 1, 2000, at 11:44:34
In reply to Re: Serzone and MDMA, posted by CraigF on October 31, 2000, at 7:55:21
> Not only that, but by taking ecstacy you are destroying your brain's ability to maintain a good mood, free of anxiety. Ask your doctor.
>
> I'm not being sanctimonious, I'm 28 myself and all my friends roll. I had to stop because it affects my moods too much in the long run.
>
> The choice is yours, but make sure you know what it is doing to your brain. Find out from your doctor, not Time magazine, not a DARE poster.I know full well what it is doing to my brain. I've done an adequate amount of research and understand the functions of serotonin and the process utilized by neurotransmitters and axons, etc. I do research on any drug that I might take-including serzone. My question is not concerning the harmful effects of E. I already know all that stuff. My question is regarding the combination of both E and serzone. That combination I do not understand as clearly. What causes the two chemicals to balance each other out? It seems that an anti-depressant that enhances serotonin would complement an illegal drug that does, in essence, the same thing. Just to let you know, I've cut down on E use specifically because I know that it can be harmful with overuse, but I also believe that in moderation, the drug can be not only safe but also can provide a unique outlet that allows me to open up and share thoughts with friends and others that I wouldn't normally feel comfortable enough to express.
[error]
[error]
[error]
[error]
[error]
[error]
[error]
[error]
[error]
[error]
[error]
[error]
[error]
Posted by Carlos on April 13, 2003, at 4:30:26
In reply to Re: Serzone and MDMA, posted by Dixon on August 24, 2000, at 11:34:58
> I have a different angle to this question. I would never trust medication that I purchased "off the streets" Do you really know what you're getting?
To answer your question... Yes, I know what I'm getting. I've watched the chemist at work and have consistant results. Unfortunately when I'm on a SSRI, MDMA is a waste of money. MDMA's AD and anti-anxiety effects are horribly decreased. I'm now on serzone and haven't done any MDMA since. I hear this is not a traditional SSRI so I may have better or worse results. I guess I'll find out next time. Best wishes.
-Carlos
Posted by fairnymph on April 16, 2003, at 23:49:38
In reply to Serzone and MDMA, posted by Nicole on October 16, 1998, at 22:54:44
You won't feel most of the effects of the MDMA if you are taking serzone.
Posted by tricksaturnsc2 on November 24, 2003, at 20:10:16
In reply to Re: Serzone and MDMA, posted by MrZest on December 10, 1998, at 8:32:46
It's funny the person that said I have bipolar type 2 & i've been able to cover it up until the past few years. They don't seem to realize that bipolar doesn't start until the early 20s (you might be depressed before then, & irritable, but that is not mania. A mixed state is not a manic state, cyclothymia & dysthymia are not bipolar).
I didn't take any drugs until I was 18, never planned to. Had depression since I was 14, developed bipolar around 19 (despite getting violent at 16), that's bipolar I which is more serious BTW.
Been 9 months drug free, never felt better. Lots of drugs kill your serotonin receptors, screwing you permanently. I used to be a cough syrup junkie & now I see everything in flashy, shimmery vision w/ perma trails. I've attempted suicide maybe 10 times since I started drugs.
you don't feel better as soon as you stop the drugs, it takes up to a year later. And you'll never be as well off as if you never took them. You'll be more irritable, more depressed, more psychotic, less intelligent.
After my last cough syrup trip, which was a trip to put all other people's to shame - it was pure dxm powder and it was 6000 mg - I thought I had alzheimer's. I was a complete maniac afterwards (I stopped breathing & was catatonic for awhile) but then I got really depressed. I was extremely agitated, I had a fast car & after not driving it for only 2 weeks I was all agitated because it seemed so slow - obviously it was no slower than before, it's just the drugs permanently slowed down everything.
I thought I had alzheimer's my memory was so bad. I would be thinking "who was it that sang jailhouse rock and blue suede shoes" even when I pictured elvis I couldn't remember his name, for example.
Ironically now i'm very sensitive to serzone, at least when I'm on remeron. I take just 50mg serzone & i'm tweaking (other meds:60mg remeron, 1750 depakote, 30mg ambien & 300 seroquel).
What obviously happened is that I changed my receptors since the last huge dxm dose (which was enough to kill anyone else - i seem to be invincible) because before I used to be on 500 mg of serzone a day while being on depakote & all the things I'm on now.
someone said neuroleptics are neurotoxic - actually quite the opposite is true. Patients that have taken neuroleptics for a long time, when you look at their brain's when they're dead, you see an INCREASED density of receptors, the body's way of counteracting the neuroleptics.
After all this rant, what is my point????
Well that drugs do mess you up permanently, reguardless of what people's level of functioning is it will be worse than if they never had taken drugs,& especially - these people that take ecstasy now
& say how great they're doing - I would love to see where these chronic ecstasy users are 50 years from now. Brain damage does not always show itself right away. Alcoholics can drink for years but then you see it finally catch up with them when they're bald, emotionless, depressed, & impotent. And ecstasy is a lot more neurotoxic than alcohol.I'd put it up there with inhalants.
Go forward in thread:
Psycho-Babble Medication | Extras | FAQ
Dr. Bob is Robert Hsiung, MD,
bob@dr-bob.org
Script revised: February 4, 2008
URL: http://www.dr-bob.org/cgi-bin/pb/mget.pl
Copyright 2006-17 Robert Hsiung.
Owned and operated by Dr. Bob LLC and not the University of Chicago.